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How to survive the coming food shortage.

12 Responses to ““Real Men Let Me Decide””

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   roger Says:
   March 24th, 2006 at 4:15 pm

   You write an interesting article.
   The problem is you fail to miss the point that the women can give a child up for adoption, but a man cannot.
   She can also abandon it – no questions asked. But the man cannot.

   Women sold the issue of “equality” to get their way in the 60s and 70s. Alot of us men bought it, and supported it.

   But what has ensued is legislation that favors women in the family court system and has greatly harmed society by tearing families apart – when everybody with a sane mind knows that kids love and need both of their parents. What has ensued is educational systems that favor women and alienate men. What has ensued is commericalism that portrays men as idiots and trys to make heros out of women that make bad reproductive decisions. What has ensued is a legal system that entitles women to jobs, education, child support, health insurance, child care, etc – for making a choice to have a child out of wedlock.

   What has ensued is “Moms, Inc” – a predatory female that expects society to hand her the keys to the car and filll it with gas. And it has. And she has driven directly into the ditch. And she single handedly raises criminals, dropouts, and under achievers. And it was her choice to do so. And only her choice.

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   TheMadNucleus Says:
   March 24th, 2006 at 10:30 pm

   Hi Jeff,

   I just recently read your article on Choice for Men when faced with unplanned pregnancies. Wow – you are quite the chivalrist! Such ideology and egalitarianism all peppered with superlative sound bites that would even make a good politician blush.
   I have some thoughts on this article but before proceeding please note that even if I had the rights that Dubay is seeking for all men – it is not likely that I personally would exercise them – I have raised 3 children as a single father with full custody and I would not trade those times for anything. To me a child is a wonderful gift and I accept fatherhood fully. But I don’t really think this is what the Dubay debate is all about.

   “All true. But it is also true that predatory males have done enormous damage to American society, and the last thing our culture needs is one more way for men to escape accountability for the children they father. Dubay wants more than the freedom to be sexually reckless – he wants that freedom to be constitutionally guaranteed. Truly he is a child of his time, passionate on the subject of rights and eager to duck responsibility.”

   Up until the above quote you made a pretty good argument pro Dubay (despite some mild insults along the way). Then you nailed it even further with your “All True” statement. From this paragraph on, however, you start to show your true colors regarding not only this issue but many others as well. You are very objective until this paragraph then all of a sudden you switch on the DOUBLE STANDARD overdrive generator. Please Jeff – get real. This whole paragraph talks about all of the bad things men have done (perhaps this is your own excuse for not being a man at some point in your life) without once mentioning how women have behaved regarding the very same issue. Is it ok for them to have the right to abandon a child??? Don’t they want that right constitutionally guaranteed??? Is it right that they not only want, but have sexual freedom of the highest degree??? Is it ok that they can have a child yet DUCK RESPONSIBILTY, even when they are far greater empowered then ever before (salary, public view, equality in the workplace, etc., etc.)??? Would Matt Dubay duck responsibility if he had some input into the choice of fathering a child??? Maybe he’s not so eager to duck responsibility but eager to be respected as a father and a man with rights that place him firmly in the decision making process when it comes to bringing a child into this world. Maybe he sees himself as a man who has the facilities and capabilities to participate in making the choice to bring a child into the world and fully accepting fatherhood – maybe he does not see himself just a sperm factory. In that one paragraph you sum up the very problem itself so clearly and have done so without even yourself noticing – you argued your point in total darkness of what the women’s responsibility is and this debate can not be made in such a narrow and isolated manner.

   Also “predatory males” – are these the males you know? They are not the males I know. Is your brother like that? Your father? Any other male friends you have. Are you like that? The overwhelming majority of men are caring people who have gotten a bad rap from people like you so that you can feel socially superior by spewing garbage about how great women are and how bad men are. Do “predatory males” exist? Clearly – there are probably just as many of them as there are predatory women – do you know about those women???. Are they any more innocent then predatory men??? Do you see a double standard here – a double standard that is easy to argue and often argued in sound bites yet rarely examined in detail?

   “The last thing our culture needs is one more way for men to escape accountability for the children they father.” First off, there is not a single method available to men so that they can “escape accountability” for their children, so this is not one more – and by the way, women have three. Unless of course you are talking about the small population of men who run and hide – that’s the overwhelming exception. If you are talking about good men – like yourself, presumably, there is not a single way to escape accountability – not that most good men would even want to. In fact the rights Dubay seeks is not about escaping accountability, it is about being respected in the process of bringing a child into this world. And besides, based on how concerned you are with the welfare and proper support system for children, you should be more concerned with the hundreds of thousands of women abandoning their own children on a daily basis – shouldn’t they be equally accountable? Worse yet, perhaps some women have a child and then keep the child to receive child support and then use the money on themselves while the children suffer due to some level of neglect. Is that possible? Have you considered that in this complicated debate? Or are women all angels and men all devils as you pontificate.

   You see this is about something different then men taking responsibility for a child – it is about two adults having equal respect for the rights of each other – so that one does not make such a critical decision about the other’s life without giving that potential parent some consideration and respect first. As it stands now a woman need not give a man any consideration regarding this situation at all.

   In addition, what has this arrangement caused historically from a societal perspective? Basically, this has caused a large population of parentless children awaiting adoption as well as cases where a parent (usually the father) is not in a position or never was in a position to be a father and hence disaster looms for the child as well. Why is this happening? It could be argued that because the pregnant or pre-conception woman has all of the decision making power in childbirth and as such, she need not consider the desires or wishes of the child’s other parent, nor the implications that she may be responsible (at least partially) for financially supporting this child. Let us, for argument sake assume that Dubay won and now men could opt out of parenting within a certain period of time from conception. A woman, prior to conception and during pregnancy would now have to consider that the man has rights in choosing to be a parent as well and then the dynamics of her choice become more critical. It is a check and balance approach. This alone may help more problems then you can imagine regarding unplanned pregnancies.

   By making both parties responsible to each other’s rights as well as the child’s rights public policy (or the law) increases the personal responsibility that each parent or potential parent must own in their decision making process. It is in no ones best interest that a woman can legally force a man into fatherhood, no more so than it is in anyone’s best interest that a man could force a woman into motherhood.

   Interestingly, your closing statement reeks of projection – I think before you question Matt Dubay’s manhood, you should first question why Jeff Jacoby feels so compelled to question the manhood of a man he doesn’t even know. Walk a mile in a man’s ……. I don’t think anyone can easily make Matt Dubay a Hero, but neither can they make him a villain. Time will answer the question as to where he fits in but in the very least we all should respect his candor in pointing to an area of society where he sees a huge inequity – something few of us would have the guts to do.

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   BobH Says:
   March 25th, 2006 at 6:29 am

   This is what I wrote to Jacoby (whom I normally like a lot)

   “‘And, in some ways saddest of all, even more people like Matt Dubay: a boy who never learned how to be a real man.’ That is just complete BS!!!

   “He made his decision and he was betrayed by a blood sucking leech. His only mistake was in being stupid enough to trust a woman. That is a very easy mistake to fix, but I guarantee that women are not going to like it the first time they walk into a bar, hoping to meet some nice guy, and realize that every man in there, at best, is only interested in one-night stands and, at worst, holds women in contempt.

   “Dubay is absolutely correct!!”

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   PolishKnight Says:
   March 25th, 2006 at 10:53 am

   Hello Bobh,

   While the term “blood sucking leech” appears to be rather vicious, consider this quote from the mother in http://www.mlive.com/news/sanews/index.ssf?/base/news-18/114243254412710.xml&coll=9

   “I believe life begins at conception and blossoms,” she said. “I take responsibility for my acts and will do my best as an adult and mother to protect and provide for our daughter.

   Elisabeth is a “vibrant, healthy baby” who is “loved dearly, and although her father has chosen not to participate in her life since conception, Elisabeth deserves financial support from her father,” Wells said.

   In other words, she wants him to “participate” in helping to raise the child (unpaid weekend baby sitter) but barring that, she just wants the money, thank you very much.

   Sweet eh?

   And she’s upset that he dares to argue about it. Why fiddle dee dee, ATM’s don’t talk back!

   And this is largely the attitude behind a lot of seemingly traditional American women who view men as disposable resources and cut them down as “whiners” if they get uppity. That’s why Jeff Jacoby is groveling: He’s worried that other men but also, particularly, women in his life will reject him. It’s a kind of feedback loop: Insecure men bash their masculinity at the demand of women and the women don’t respect the men because they’re insecure. (Putting it that way, we almost need to feel sorry for Jeff, eh? He’s probably a sitzenpinkler.)

   Nowhere in the interviews I read from her did she express any notion of remorse or sympathy for Matt Dubay for his situation nor “responsibility” (put in quotes because she uses this primarily to demand money from him) for her own backing out of her repeated assertions that she wasn’t going to produce a child or warn him that she was a pro-lifer.

   Indeed, such a culture produces “sexual predators” because traditional relationships become so risky for men. Basically, the liabilities for a man during a one-night stand and a more traditional dating relationship are the same: He must wear a condom during each sexual encounter and ensure that it’s destroyed afterward. During a traditional relationship, it’s even more difficult for him to protect himself because such women will argue that he should “trust” her claims she can’t get pregnant, for example.

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   roger Says:
   March 25th, 2006 at 11:13 am

   Mr. Jacoby’s intellectual framework is stuck in the pre-1950s.

   His observations would be very valid if the woman did NOT have the legal right to abandonment, adoption, and abortion.

   Perhaps my Jacoby is calling for the ellimination of the rights to legally abort and abandon. Perhaps this is his real message.

   Then, and only then, could men reasonably be held accountable for an “unwanted” child.

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   Staff Says:
   March 25th, 2006 at 12:09 pm

   Roger – you have hit on the crux of the issue: Women are permitted by law in this country to abort their children-in-utero – without consulting or even notifying the father. Irrespective of what you may think about legal abortion, denying fathers the option to “abort” responsibility for raising that same child is simple discrimination.

   But what really burns me up about Jacoby’s commentary is his pitiful and pathetic reliance on “shame” to discourage anyone from even considering the possibility that there could be such a thing as Choice for MEN. Whenever someone starts to talk about what “real men” ought to do, they have lost the argument ipso facto.

   Shame on you, Jeff Jacoby.

   Mike LaSalle
   Editor, MensNewsDaily.com

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   PolishKnight Says:
   March 25th, 2006 at 12:15 pm

   Hello Roger,

   I would go even farther and argue that he’s not stuck in a time warp of the pre-1950’s but in a hyper-chivalrous culture that didn’t exist even back then.

   The notion of women sleeping around with boyfriends and demanding child-support for unwed motherhood afterward was inconceivable during the puritannical 1950’s. Such a woman as his ex-girlfriend would have quietly had the child, adopted it out, and been quiet about it. Or she would have asked him to marry her or sought some other man to do so. But the notion of being an unwed mother with a support check and bragging about it was unthinkable back then.

   American men are such incredible wimps. They are often shocked when I brag that my wife packs a lunch for me. This isn’t a lot of work (we already have dinner from the night before) but for a man to have his wife do something for him, especially traditional, blows most American men’s minds. They’re basically doggies that have been trained by sex treats.

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   rastus Says:
   March 25th, 2006 at 2:41 pm

   Do these comments actually get back to Jeff? I certainly hope so.

   I, too, generally like what he has to say, but he is tragically off base on this issue. As Roger pointed out, Jacoby’s position would be justified ONLY if women were to lose the “rights to legally abort and abandon.” Jeff needs to understand that. Perhaps some of this commentary will help him in that regard.

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   DcFather Says:
   March 26th, 2006 at 8:26 am

   The author of the article is himself stuck in a time warp. Its a time where women have choices, damn the consequences for men, children, other women, and society – and men have to take responsibility for women’s choices to prevent society from crumbling. Yes, society will falter if men have choices too, because there will be nobody left to take responsibility. Here is a brilliant idea, how about both parents have equal rights and both parents have equal responsibility – you know, treat people equally under color of law regardless of sex. Hmmm, I think I may be on to something brilliant!

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    tonysprout Says:
    March 26th, 2006 at 8:54 am

    I like the way you guys put it.

    This is what I emailed Jacoby:

    This is a new world with new rules. Rules have changed for females. Men are still required to shut up,step up, and sacrifice mind, life, limb, and health for a country that despises them, and shows that lack of respect in family court See here for a small taste: http://dwb.newsobserver.com/news/ncwire_news/story/2917868p-9367023c.html

    Regarding Choice For Men; all we demand is equality with our “sisters”. Equality that MEN have fought and died for. Let’s level the playing field. Women can legally abort, in the minds of some, murder, a man’s child without so much as a nod in his direction. Yet she has also the ability to force a man to drop his future finances, education, career and family planning merely on her whim to play mommy.

    Matt Dubay is an American Hero. He refuses to be cornered and whipped by a misandrist family court system that will steal his hard earned cash and make him beg to be a mere visitor in this child’s life. He, like the millions of women who abort, adopt out, and legally abandon their babies, has better plans for his future. She had a legal choice to shape her own future. Give Matt, and men, the same choice.

    Men’s lack of a womb does not mean lack of equal rights, any more than a person who lacks legs or arms has less rights to a full and productive life.

    Q:”What about the children?” A:” Her body, her choice.” Her responsibility.

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    BobH Says:
    March 26th, 2006 at 1:22 pm

    Another short e-mail for Jeff Jacoby:

    “You want the Dubay to marry the woman?!?!? Why?? So that she can go off and get pregnant by some other guy and stick him with the child support payments? You’ve written at least one column on paternity fraud and pertinent laws. Go back and read it!! Men who get married are suicidal and stupid.”

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    sorenlerby Says:
    March 28th, 2006 at 12:27 am

    In modern America, where manhood is universally condemned for every political and social mishaps and illnesses, from the Iraq war to economy, poverty, social development, environment and everything else as testosterone-driven, reckless, and dominating Neanderthal value, there is still one area, and only one area, where manhood is still valued: when it comes to paying child support. In other words, when it comes to benefit women. The need to fictitiously hail manliness is even greater when the man was deceived into parenthood and enforced a child support by the court, such as in the case of Mr. Dubay.

    In a world where male behavior and traits are constantly ridiculed in media and TV, where male attributes and values are scoffed and written off as thing of the past, where men are easy target for allegation for sexual harassment, domestic violence, abuse and discrimination, and where men are forced to undergo mind-programming course such as sensitivity training or rape awareness class where men are taught to introspect on their inner feminine side and cultivate sensitivity, feminists and politically correct media has prescribed the only area where men could exhibit their manliness.

    We would love to see Jeff Jacoby, a male columnist for Boston Globe showing off his own manliness in any way he wants, but manliness that this metrosexual columnist (I guess) demands of Mr. Dubay comes with no cheap price tag. It`s 18 plus years of child support that we are talking about. It would be quite easy for Mr. Jacoby to extol the virtue of manhood from his comfortable office, where he has nothing to worry about. People like him would realize the dire situation of men in today`s America only when he himself is tricked into fatherhood and slapped with huge child support by court. Of course in that case, we expect that he will react “manly”.

    I would suggest that some women, could be any woman walking on the street, to go to a court and claim Mr. Jacoby as her child`s father. No proof, DNA or otherwise, will be required. I want to see how Mr. Jacoby`s face upon hearing the court order him to pay the child support.

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