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Two Very Different Women…

2006-07-04
By

Two young women were debating the other day over whether or not they should’ve waited until they were married to have sex (yeah, my ears perked up for that one…): 

“If you must know, my husband and I were both virgins when we married, I was 20 and he was 26, almost 27.   Now I’ll be 33 next week and he’ll be 40 in October and we’re still married. And neither of us has cheated, either.  And no, I do not feel like I’m “missing out” on anything.” 

At hearing this, another lady, single, piped in with “Whatever. Personally, I’d prefer someone who was confident in themselves & whose life I could share in and vice versa, without insecurity, d/s roles, and fundie stereotypes coming into play…. Or in other words: I prefer not to be terminally barefoot & pregnant and chained to the stove.” 

I was shocked by the level of antagonism in the second one’s statement.  What’s wrong with monogamy?  When did self control and commitment become a ‘bad thing?’ Should I consider myself cursed if I were to marry a woman who thought that it was one of her primary purposes in life to please me? And by reciprocation, I should only please her? To save and keep sacred that which holds the purpose of creating life to be between yourself and your spouse, is that a bad thing?  I think it is beautiful… even a cynical, divorced jerk like me finds that level of commitment commendable. 

Two people can have a lifelong loving relationship without the Husband/ king and master-wife/servant and babymaker mentality. I’ve seen it… I know it exists. Sometimes it is a bit depressing when I see a good couple because I would have loved to have had a marriage like that.  But so many unmarried women these days think if they engage in a ‘give and take’ relationship with a man that somehow they’re being a ‘doormat’ and not being respected… Somewhere they have been taught that if a man has needs, or even demands, he doesn’t ‘appreciate’ them.  In other words, from the time they were 12-14 years old, the boys were always ‘being nice’ and trying to curry favor with the ladies.  Courtship and dating is one thing; a committed relationship is entirely another.

Most of those women will go from relationship… to relationship… to relationship… and maybe a marriage or two and end their days angry and bitter and lonely. This too I have seen. Does the name Maureen Dowd ring a bell?

All Comments Welcome: Eric Johnson

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Didn't make Oprah's Book Club. And Ronnie doesn't care. Man up. Buy the book now on Amazon.com. Or listen to Ronnie tell a story at escaping-from-reality.com.


  • debi912

    Unless, the career woman gets “bored” with the relationship and decides she wants some “space”. Or the man gets too “uppity” and doesn’t want to wash dishes. etc. In other words, two people who are so similar to each other, so “equal”, are little more than living together as girlfriend/boyfriend. As Frank Sinatra put it (probably his songwriter did), love is a tender trap.

    My sister in the middle of her second divorce, called me up to complain that all “THIS” wouldn’t be nesessary if he could just understand that she needs her own life, too! I think that if you want a life of your own you shouldn’t get married or have kids.

  • debi912

    Unless, the career woman gets “bored” with the relationship and decides she wants some “space”. Or the man gets too “uppity” and doesn’t want to wash dishes. etc. In other words, two people who are so similar to each other, so “equal”, are little more than living together as girlfriend/boyfriend. As Frank Sinatra put it (probably his songwriter did), love is a tender trap.

    My sister in the middle of her second divorce, called me up to complain that all “THIS” wouldn’t be nesessary if he could just understand that she needs her own life, too! I think that if you want a life of your own you shouldn’t get married or have kids.

  • PolishKnight

    Two people can have a lifelong loving relationship without the Husband/ king and master-wife/servant and babymaker mentality. I’ve seen it… I know it exists.

    I like to play out of the box a little and criticize the author, Eric, moreso than the self-absorbed woman he was overhearing. We all know about these kinds of women and can criticize them, but let’s focus on us men in how our attitudes contribute to the problem.

    His romantic ideal sounds remarkably similar to what the princess was saying she wanted. And such relationships do exist: Yuppie #1 meets Yuppie #2, move in together, get married, have 1.2 kids, and live happily ever after.

    Unless, the career woman gets “bored” with the relationship and decides she wants some “space”. Or the man gets too “uppity” and doesn’t want to wash dishes. etc. In other words, two people who are so similar to each other, so “equal”, are little more than living together as girlfriend/boyfriend. As Frank Sinatra put it (probably his songwriter did), love is a tender trap.

    Such relationships seem like asexual reproduction which make bonding difficult. If someone is that independent, how do they pair with someone else? Career and liberated women start to think about settling down in their 30′s just as men start to gain serious sexual power.

  • PolishKnight

    Two people can have a lifelong loving relationship without the Husband/ king and master-wife/servant and babymaker mentality. I’ve seen it… I know it exists.

    I like to play out of the box a little and criticize the author, Eric, moreso than the self-absorbed woman he was overhearing. We all know about these kinds of women and can criticize them, but let’s focus on us men in how our attitudes contribute to the problem.

    His romantic ideal sounds remarkably similar to what the princess was saying she wanted. And such relationships do exist: Yuppie #1 meets Yuppie #2, move in together, get married, have 1.2 kids, and live happily ever after.

    Unless, the career woman gets “bored” with the relationship and decides she wants some “space”. Or the man gets too “uppity” and doesn’t want to wash dishes. etc. In other words, two people who are so similar to each other, so “equal”, are little more than living together as girlfriend/boyfriend. As Frank Sinatra put it (probably his songwriter did), love is a tender trap.

    Such relationships seem like asexual reproduction which make bonding difficult. If someone is that independent, how do they pair with someone else? Career and liberated women start to think about settling down in their 30′s just as men start to gain serious sexual power.

  • Gus

    The original feminist generation was sold a Marxist bill of goods (what else did “Red Betty” have to sell?) about the nature of work and what it means to be a woman.
    The Baby Boomer woman who bought into it and their daughters are reaping the fruits of that idiocy now. I don’t know what anybody else’s life is like but in mine angry 50 year old women are all over the place and the more “educated” they are, the angrier they are. Their daughters are in sexual confusion because their heads have been told that only lesbians are “real women” while their bodies and emotions are sending opposite messages.
    The Baby Boomer women are hopeless cases. They staked their lives on the “career”-”All men are rapists” nonsense and lost. I still wonder how they felt when Gloria Steinem hauled off and got MARRIED at 61, not something the average 61 year old woman can do. That must have been like hearing that Dr Martin Luther King, Jr went to work as “Bull” Connor’s houseboy. Too bad.
    I’ve had enough of this nonsense. I limit my contact with women very carefully, take no shit and find myself quite happy. American women have a vastly inflated view of their toughness, value and intelligence.

  • Gus

    The original feminist generation was sold a Marxist bill of goods (what else did “Red Betty” have to sell?) about the nature of work and what it means to be a woman.
    The Baby Boomer woman who bought into it and their daughters are reaping the fruits of that idiocy now. I don’t know what anybody else’s life is like but in mine angry 50 year old women are all over the place and the more “educated” they are, the angrier they are. Their daughters are in sexual confusion because their heads have been told that only lesbians are “real women” while their bodies and emotions are sending opposite messages.
    The Baby Boomer women are hopeless cases. They staked their lives on the “career”-”All men are rapists” nonsense and lost. I still wonder how they felt when Gloria Steinem hauled off and got MARRIED at 61, not something the average 61 year old woman can do. That must have been like hearing that Dr Martin Luther King, Jr went to work as “Bull” Connor’s houseboy. Too bad.
    I’ve had enough of this nonsense. I limit my contact with women very carefully, take no shit and find myself quite happy. American women have a vastly inflated view of their toughness, value and intelligence.

  • DadWithGirls

    When 2nd wave feminism discovered the neat sleight-of-hand by imposing Marxist class-warfare language onto gender relations (hence our beloved “gender wars”), it also accomplished beyond rhetorical polarization a grievous and violent interpersonal divide between women and men.

    Relating to one’s opposite gender automatically became a contest instead of a dance, a zero-sum power struggle instead of a mutually respectful negotiation.

    Every bourgeois, chivalrous, or feminine romantic sentiment had to be deconstructed and interrogated and debunked within the new feminist ideology of the Evil Patriarchy and ubiquitous female victimhood.

    Occasionally one comes across heretical voices from unlikely sources.

    Excerpts from the first three pages of Dr. Laura Schlessinger’s book – The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands. (Bad marketeering title with condescending undertones, but the text is another story.)

    “There isn’t a day that goes by when I don’t ask at least one woman caller on my radio program if she expects to stay married considering her hostile, dismissive, or undermining attitude and actions toward her husband. What is amazing is how surprised they all seem to imagine that their husbands might have a limit to how much they’ll take before they tune out or turn away.

    What is even more amazing is that this insensitivity to their husband’s needs and feelings goes hand in hand with a hypersensitivity about any action or reaction from men – reactions that are usually more than reasonable.

    What causes this double-standard mentality? In one big, hyphenated word: self-centeredness. And what is the source of this self-centeredness? I believe it’s a result of the women’s movement, with its condemnation of just about everything male as evil, stupid, oppressive, and the denigration of female and male roles in families …” (L.S.)

    (And, to give the opposing voice it’s nod –)

    “The idea of a wife starts to sound pretty good -having someone do your laundry, cheer every time you walk in the door, have dinner waiting for you when you get home. In the words of a female friend of mine: ‘Who wouldn’t want one of these wives? I’d like a wife!’ The problem is, who wants to be one?”

    (From a book review by Jennifer Burgess)

    http://www.womenwriters.net/winter05/ProperCareandFeedingofHusbands1.htm

  • DadWithGirls

    When 2nd wave feminism discovered the neat sleight-of-hand by imposing Marxist class-warfare language onto gender relations (hence our beloved “gender wars”), it also accomplished beyond rhetorical polarization a grievous and violent interpersonal divide between women and men.

    Relating to one’s opposite gender automatically became a contest instead of a dance, a zero-sum power struggle instead of a mutually respectful negotiation.

    Every bourgeois, chivalrous, or feminine romantic sentiment had to be deconstructed and interrogated and debunked within the new feminist ideology of the Evil Patriarchy and ubiquitous female victimhood.

    Occasionally one comes across heretical voices from unlikely sources.

    Excerpts from the first three pages of Dr. Laura Schlessinger’s book – The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands. (Bad marketeering title with condescending undertones, but the text is another story.)

    “There isn’t a day that goes by when I don’t ask at least one woman caller on my radio program if she expects to stay married considering her hostile, dismissive, or undermining attitude and actions toward her husband. What is amazing is how surprised they all seem to imagine that their husbands might have a limit to how much they’ll take before they tune out or turn away.

    What is even more amazing is that this insensitivity to their husband’s needs and feelings goes hand in hand with a hypersensitivity about any action or reaction from men – reactions that are usually more than reasonable.

    What causes this double-standard mentality? In one big, hyphenated word: self-centeredness. And what is the source of this self-centeredness? I believe it’s a result of the women’s movement, with its condemnation of just about everything male as evil, stupid, oppressive, and the denigration of female and male roles in families …” (L.S.)

    (And, to give the opposing voice it’s nod –)

    “The idea of a wife starts to sound pretty good -having someone do your laundry, cheer every time you walk in the door, have dinner waiting for you when you get home. In the words of a female friend of mine: ‘Who wouldn’t want one of these wives? I’d like a wife!’ The problem is, who wants to be one?”

    (From a book review by Jennifer Burgess)

    http://www.womenwriters.net/winter05/ProperCareandFeedingofHusbands1.htm

  • fourthwire

    “Whatever. Personally, I’d prefer someone who was confident in themselves & whose life I could share in and vice versa, without insecurity, d/s roles, and fundie stereotypes coming into play…. Or in other words: I prefer not to be terminally barefoot & pregnant and chained to the stove.”

    Anyone beginning a refutation with the phrase “Whatever” generally isn’t the brightest bulb, having been educated in such a manner as to avoid the least possibility of learning critical thought processes.

    Virtually ALL women prefer men who are “confident in themselves”.

    As for that particular knucklehead’s aspirations to “share life” with someone, without “insecurity, d/s roles, and fundie stereotypes”, she probably ought to throw in “world peace” as well as “the end of poverty as we know it”.

    She seems to be another example of ideological programming, with aspirations to entitlement, victimhood and self-centeredness already planted in the space between her ears.

    As for her fear of being “terminally barefoot & pregnant”, she undoubtedly misses the point that plenty of women in their late 30′s, 40′s, and even 50′s are urgently seeking precisely that particular state of affairs for themselves.

  • fourthwire

    “Whatever. Personally, I’d prefer someone who was confident in themselves & whose life I could share in and vice versa, without insecurity, d/s roles, and fundie stereotypes coming into play…. Or in other words: I prefer not to be terminally barefoot & pregnant and chained to the stove.”

    Anyone beginning a refutation with the phrase “Whatever” generally isn’t the brightest bulb, having been educated in such a manner as to avoid the least possibility of learning critical thought processes.

    Virtually ALL women prefer men who are “confident in themselves”.

    As for that particular knucklehead’s aspirations to “share life” with someone, without “insecurity, d/s roles, and fundie stereotypes”, she probably ought to throw in “world peace” as well as “the end of poverty as we know it”.

    She seems to be another example of ideological programming, with aspirations to entitlement, victimhood and self-centeredness already planted in the space between her ears.

    As for her fear of being “terminally barefoot & pregnant”, she undoubtedly misses the point that plenty of women in their late 30′s, 40′s, and even 50′s are urgently seeking precisely that particular state of affairs for themselves.







Right.

Man up.

Buy the book now on Amazon.com. Or listen to Ronnie tell a story at escaping-from-reality.com.

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