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	<title>Comments on: Oil Price Gouging: From Enron With Love</title>
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	<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/</link>
	<description>Men&#039;s Rights Activism, MRA Politics, Analysis, Commentary and Global News</description>
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		<title>By: Rep. party failures of recent years (part 2) &#171; Failures - exposed, reflected upon, considered</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77077</link>
		<dc:creator>Rep. party failures of recent years (part 2) &#171; Failures - exposed, reflected upon, considered</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Nov 2008 12:47:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77077</guid>
		<description>[...] Sustainable and Secure Energy: Republicans have been opposing a renewable portfolio standard and any legislation to save substantial amounts of imported oil.Â  They also failed to ensure that energy speculators are not manipulating prices and that consumers are not being gouged at the pump. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Sustainable and Secure Energy: Republicans have been opposing a renewable portfolio standard and any legislation to save substantial amounts of imported oil.Â  They also failed to ensure that energy speculators are not manipulating prices and that consumers are not being gouged at the pump. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: conservativation</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77076</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jun 2007 14:17:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77076</guid>
		<description>Will thanks for the hat tip....David touched only a little on supply demand fundamentals, and focused more on the EEEVIIILLLL futures market. That was the focus of my rebuttal, though exactly like you said, I also touched on the regs and taxes etc.
Higher prices may indeed be a good thing though, meaning that is also the market as work...and if it incents new production or even conservation...market driven conservation is the only real kind...the rest is ribbon bracelet and t-shirt declaring liberal feel goodism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will thanks for the hat tip&#8230;.David touched only a little on supply demand fundamentals, and focused more on the EEEVIIILLLL futures market. That was the focus of my rebuttal, though exactly like you said, I also touched on the regs and taxes etc.<br />
Higher prices may indeed be a good thing though, meaning that is also the market as work&#8230;and if it incents new production or even conservation&#8230;market driven conservation is the only real kind&#8230;the rest is ribbon bracelet and t-shirt declaring liberal feel goodism.</p>
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		<title>By: Will Malven</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77075</link>
		<dc:creator>Will Malven</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Jun 2007 15:27:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77075</guid>
		<description>Scottkirk,

Nothing intelligent to say? Just personal attack?  My how clever you are.

I based my statement on my 20+ years of personal experience in the industry.  I know what has been occurring in the industry, and the reason for prices being as they are.

Try, just for once, to use that organ in your head called a brain for something other than filling the vacuum between your ears.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Scottkirk,</p>
<p>Nothing intelligent to say? Just personal attack?  My how clever you are.</p>
<p>I based my statement on my 20+ years of personal experience in the industry.  I know what has been occurring in the industry, and the reason for prices being as they are.</p>
<p>Try, just for once, to use that organ in your head called a brain for something other than filling the vacuum between your ears.</p>
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		<title>By: Will Malven</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77058</link>
		<dc:creator>Will Malven</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Jun 2007 13:19:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77058</guid>
		<description>This is what happens when an egoist like Mr. Usher begins writing articles concerning that about which he knows absolutely nothing.

Liberals often do this and as I have previously pointed out, Mr. Usher is a Liberal. He doesn&#039;t truly believe in a free market, he believes in a government regulated market.  Only government can truly tell us how commodities can be traded.

The lack of refining capacity, and its causes is no secret, and has been noted by &quot;big oil&quot; for some time.  Its just that some &quot;experts,&quot; generally self-annointed-don&#039;t like the explanation and therefore choose to ignore the underlying facts.

GAsoline prices rise solely due to supply and demand pressures.  Refineries across America are generally running well above their designed capacities (110-120%).  This is due to efficiencies in operations and new and better catalysts being invented by those evil private corporations who then-gasp-dare to seek to recover the cost of development of these efficiencies.

Developing new technologies is neither easy nor cheap.  I have 20+ years of experience in production, enhanced oil-recovery, and in refining.  Corporation spend a tremendous amount of money in R&amp;D.

The other reason for the shortage of gasoline and the resultant high prices is the difficulty in obtaining the required permits, licenses and approvals from local, state, and federal authorities.  As in the building of a nuclear power plant, our government entities, spurred mostly by tree-hugging Liberals, have made the construction untenable.  They did this by intent, not serendipitously.

Groups like the Sierra Club have made it their business to interfere with energy corporations wherever and whenever they could, and they have been astoundingly successful, and networks like NPR and self-proclaimed experts like Mr. Usher have provided them the support they have needed to accomplish their aims.

A simple exercise for those of you who so strenuously object to the price you are currently paying at the pump is to look at the rise in the price of comparable commodities over the same time period.  Compare the price of gasoline in the early and mid 70&#039;s with the price of milk, bottled water, bread and most any other consumer product.  Then compare the prices of today. You will find that on a percent inflation basis, gasoline lags far behind most other items on your list.

Oh yeah, and remember that it is those same folks on the Left who, like Al Gore, believe that higher prices on gasoline are ultimately good for America because they force people to drive less.  The only reason they are upset with the higher prices is that the profits go to our citizens, the investors who comprise these corporations, rather than to the government, where we are to believe, they will spend the money far more wisely than can we poor ignorant citizens.

Small wonder Mr. Usher has chosen to stop allowing comments to his posts, he can&#039;t stand the heat.

Conservativation has absolutely destroyed your entire premise and your prevarications won&#039;t change that.

Oh yeah, and NPR is nothing more that a leftist propaganda machine.  He&#039;s correct about that as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is what happens when an egoist like Mr. Usher begins writing articles concerning that about which he knows absolutely nothing.</p>
<p>Liberals often do this and as I have previously pointed out, Mr. Usher is a Liberal. He doesn&#8217;t truly believe in a free market, he believes in a government regulated market.  Only government can truly tell us how commodities can be traded.</p>
<p>The lack of refining capacity, and its causes is no secret, and has been noted by &#8220;big oil&#8221; for some time.  Its just that some &#8220;experts,&#8221; generally self-annointed-don&#8217;t like the explanation and therefore choose to ignore the underlying facts.</p>
<p>GAsoline prices rise solely due to supply and demand pressures.  Refineries across America are generally running well above their designed capacities (110-120%).  This is due to efficiencies in operations and new and better catalysts being invented by those evil private corporations who then-gasp-dare to seek to recover the cost of development of these efficiencies.</p>
<p>Developing new technologies is neither easy nor cheap.  I have 20+ years of experience in production, enhanced oil-recovery, and in refining.  Corporation spend a tremendous amount of money in R&amp;D.</p>
<p>The other reason for the shortage of gasoline and the resultant high prices is the difficulty in obtaining the required permits, licenses and approvals from local, state, and federal authorities.  As in the building of a nuclear power plant, our government entities, spurred mostly by tree-hugging Liberals, have made the construction untenable.  They did this by intent, not serendipitously.</p>
<p>Groups like the Sierra Club have made it their business to interfere with energy corporations wherever and whenever they could, and they have been astoundingly successful, and networks like NPR and self-proclaimed experts like Mr. Usher have provided them the support they have needed to accomplish their aims.</p>
<p>A simple exercise for those of you who so strenuously object to the price you are currently paying at the pump is to look at the rise in the price of comparable commodities over the same time period.  Compare the price of gasoline in the early and mid 70&#8217;s with the price of milk, bottled water, bread and most any other consumer product.  Then compare the prices of today. You will find that on a percent inflation basis, gasoline lags far behind most other items on your list.</p>
<p>Oh yeah, and remember that it is those same folks on the Left who, like Al Gore, believe that higher prices on gasoline are ultimately good for America because they force people to drive less.  The only reason they are upset with the higher prices is that the profits go to our citizens, the investors who comprise these corporations, rather than to the government, where we are to believe, they will spend the money far more wisely than can we poor ignorant citizens.</p>
<p>Small wonder Mr. Usher has chosen to stop allowing comments to his posts, he can&#8217;t stand the heat.</p>
<p>Conservativation has absolutely destroyed your entire premise and your prevarications won&#8217;t change that.</p>
<p>Oh yeah, and NPR is nothing more that a leftist propaganda machine.  He&#8217;s correct about that as well.</p>
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		<title>By: MartianBachelor</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77074</link>
		<dc:creator>MartianBachelor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 16:11:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77074</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;For many years, Presidents and politicians have repeatedly promised actions to reduce dependence on foreign oil, while knowingly permitting oil companies to decrease stateside production capacity&lt;/i&gt;

You make it sound like a conspiracy, but I think it&#039;s just the physical maturity of American production and no/few new big finds; they aren&#039;t drilling to tens of thousands of feet in The Gulf for nothing.  Fields in texas and oklahoma (as well as alaska) have been in production for so long that we&#039;re on the inevitable backside of the Hubbert curve.

Otherwise, what conservativation&#039;s been saying...  Maybe there&#039;s something subtle in your piece that I&#039;m missing, but I don&#039;t think the spot oil market is even 5% of what moves via futures contracts, which exist to help companies plan ahead.  Yes, there&#039;s lots of speculative money in the futures markets, but it serves the purpose of supplying liquidity to the system so there&#039;s always someone available to take the other side of a trade, and if correctly done it&#039;s rewarded for supplying that service.

Really big money can temporarily move the futures markets because of the leverage involved, but the fix is to increase margin requirements - just as was done with stocks following 1929.  Arguably, the futures markets are Ok with 10% margin because the underlying involves something real and physical.  Arbitraging will keep the spot market from deviating very far from the futures for very long.  So I just don&#039;t see how it can be important.

Enron was able to screw california by being able to take advantage of the fact that the electricity market is regional/national, whereas the oil market is global and less easily controlled by a single entity.  Enron set itself up as the market maker in electricity and was therefore able to wrack things in its favor by being on both sides of the market - but only for a relative blip in time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>For many years, Presidents and politicians have repeatedly promised actions to reduce dependence on foreign oil, while knowingly permitting oil companies to decrease stateside production capacity</i></p>
<p>You make it sound like a conspiracy, but I think it&#8217;s just the physical maturity of American production and no/few new big finds; they aren&#8217;t drilling to tens of thousands of feet in The Gulf for nothing.  Fields in texas and oklahoma (as well as alaska) have been in production for so long that we&#8217;re on the inevitable backside of the Hubbert curve.</p>
<p>Otherwise, what conservativation&#8217;s been saying&#8230;  Maybe there&#8217;s something subtle in your piece that I&#8217;m missing, but I don&#8217;t think the spot oil market is even 5% of what moves via futures contracts, which exist to help companies plan ahead.  Yes, there&#8217;s lots of speculative money in the futures markets, but it serves the purpose of supplying liquidity to the system so there&#8217;s always someone available to take the other side of a trade, and if correctly done it&#8217;s rewarded for supplying that service.</p>
<p>Really big money can temporarily move the futures markets because of the leverage involved, but the fix is to increase margin requirements &#8211; just as was done with stocks following 1929.  Arguably, the futures markets are Ok with 10% margin because the underlying involves something real and physical.  Arbitraging will keep the spot market from deviating very far from the futures for very long.  So I just don&#8217;t see how it can be important.</p>
<p>Enron was able to screw california by being able to take advantage of the fact that the electricity market is regional/national, whereas the oil market is global and less easily controlled by a single entity.  Enron set itself up as the market maker in electricity and was therefore able to wrack things in its favor by being on both sides of the market &#8211; but only for a relative blip in time.</p>
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		<title>By: conservativation</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77073</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 12:46:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77073</guid>
		<description>There is no useful analogy between marriage and the &quot;market&quot;...any market, though we losely use the term marriage market. Buyers, Sellers? Be the a man or a woman they can only &quot;own&quot; one at a time, and cannot materially impact the &quot;market&quot;....if the license is the product it can only be owned one at a time.
Sure intrinsic &quot;value&quot; of marriage can change, but it in no way speaks to the issue here. Anyway...enough from me on markets.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is no useful analogy between marriage and the &#8220;market&#8221;&#8230;any market, though we losely use the term marriage market. Buyers, Sellers? Be the a man or a woman they can only &#8220;own&#8221; one at a time, and cannot materially impact the &#8220;market&#8221;&#8230;.if the license is the product it can only be owned one at a time.<br />
Sure intrinsic &#8220;value&#8221; of marriage can change, but it in no way speaks to the issue here. Anyway&#8230;enough from me on markets.</p>
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		<title>By: David R. Usher</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77072</link>
		<dc:creator>David R. Usher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 21:38:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77072</guid>
		<description>Any market subject to massive gratuitous external interference is not a free market.  The notion that a market is free in a complete absence of regulation is nonsense.  Regulation is sometimes necessary in order to keep a market free.  Where the state becomes an active participant in market raiding, a statist conflict of interest exists.  This will not change unless voters rise up and hold their feet to the fire.

Case in point: the marriage market has been destroyed by no-fault divorce and automated child support entitlements.  The marriage market will not be free unless laws are changed to prevent invasion of the marriage market by feminists and governmental bodies who vicariously profit from the destruction of marriage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any market subject to massive gratuitous external interference is not a free market.  The notion that a market is free in a complete absence of regulation is nonsense.  Regulation is sometimes necessary in order to keep a market free.  Where the state becomes an active participant in market raiding, a statist conflict of interest exists.  This will not change unless voters rise up and hold their feet to the fire.</p>
<p>Case in point: the marriage market has been destroyed by no-fault divorce and automated child support entitlements.  The marriage market will not be free unless laws are changed to prevent invasion of the marriage market by feminists and governmental bodies who vicariously profit from the destruction of marriage.</p>
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		<title>By: thurston861</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77071</link>
		<dc:creator>thurston861</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 20:36:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77071</guid>
		<description>Careful Cons. We all know what happens when you gore the Statst Ox. (wink wink)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Careful Cons. We all know what happens when you gore the Statst Ox. (wink wink)</p>
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		<title>By: conservativation</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77070</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 20:20:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77070</guid>
		<description>David you&#039;ve just overtly contradicted yourself...in order to keep it free we must restrict the participants? The contradiction is more then semantics.
So do we limit the stock market to the companies listed being able to buy and sell? Can only families who rent go and buy a home?
It just doesn&#039;t fly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David you&#8217;ve just overtly contradicted yourself&#8230;in order to keep it free we must restrict the participants? The contradiction is more then semantics.<br />
So do we limit the stock market to the companies listed being able to buy and sell? Can only families who rent go and buy a home?<br />
It just doesn&#8217;t fly.</p>
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		<title>By: David R. Usher</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77069</link>
		<dc:creator>David R. Usher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 20:10:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77069</guid>
		<description>This is a major point of this article: in order to keep the oil market free, you have to regulate who can and cannot participate in it.  This is not regulation of the market itself: it is firewall regulation to keep the market open and free.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a major point of this article: in order to keep the oil market free, you have to regulate who can and cannot participate in it.  This is not regulation of the market itself: it is firewall regulation to keep the market open and free.</p>
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		<title>By: conservativation</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77068</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 19:01:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77068</guid>
		<description>Believe me thurston I can see why the opposite view exists, and respect those who hold it. Invective about BIIIIGGG OOIILLLL is the norm, and JR Ewing didn&#039;t help. My argument isn&#039;t a grand one, defending oil per se as the nectar it has become. My points reside within the industry and come from the two sides that say...

Specualtion Bad, Oil companies gouge, therefore regulate

vs.

Well, what Ive said.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Believe me thurston I can see why the opposite view exists, and respect those who hold it. Invective about BIIIIGGG OOIILLLL is the norm, and JR Ewing didn&#8217;t help. My argument isn&#8217;t a grand one, defending oil per se as the nectar it has become. My points reside within the industry and come from the two sides that say&#8230;</p>
<p>Specualtion Bad, Oil companies gouge, therefore regulate</p>
<p>vs.</p>
<p>Well, what Ive said.</p>
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		<title>By: thurston861</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77067</link>
		<dc:creator>thurston861</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:56:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77067</guid>
		<description>I am sure that this would be a 40 hour course for me to consume Cons.

Still on the other side though. It is going to take reading and lots of time, but you are factaul and dispassionate, and that helps!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am sure that this would be a 40 hour course for me to consume Cons.</p>
<p>Still on the other side though. It is going to take reading and lots of time, but you are factaul and dispassionate, and that helps!</p>
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		<title>By: conservativation</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77066</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:50:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77066</guid>
		<description>CORRECTION...sentence 7 should say &quot;more shorts than longs&quot; not the reverse</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CORRECTION&#8230;sentence 7 should say &#8220;more shorts than longs&#8221; not the reverse</p>
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		<title>By: conservativation</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77065</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:44:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77065</guid>
		<description>I failed to mention that in the late 90&#039;s when oil approached USD 10/bbl and gasoline dipped below a dollar in many places, it was these same speculators pressing downwards. Industry was losing billions, and they simply kept going. The point about them losing big then and winning big now is often made. I&#039;m just adding that the net of all futures contracts in the energy complex during that time was massively short...more puts than calls, more longs than shorts. Today, speculators see supply demand factors, such as China trotting about sewing up more and more physical supplies, China, India, etc., all huge growing economies needing more and more oil, and in reality not a whole lot of extra supply coming (but talk of peak production is nonsense...it is peak at THESE economics and with this set of regulations), they also see wars and instabilities literally on top of the oil wells, etc. etc. and see being long the better bet. Micro moves up and down aside, they are dead correct in the macro and the net of all futures contracts these days will trend towrds the long side, more buyers than sellers.
Speculators read the tea leaves and put money for mouth, thereby defining the market in exact terms based on best guess with all factors. To suggest they are a problem begs the comparison then of real estate speculators...and any speculator for that matter. Buying ever increasing home and real estate values on a bet creates artificial demand, meaning a family needn&#039;t own all these homes...they are simply &quot;for profit&quot; purchases. Shall we regulate that as well? To my mind they aren&#039;t making anymore land (except in Holland with ocean reclaim and new islands off Dubai...wink)
so is it &quot;fair&quot; that those with cash can push up the price of this fundamental substance?
Or the stock market...what about that? Is it bad the increases? Are the huge retirement funds and investment houses, 401k&#039;s and mutuals doing a dirty deed by buying long positions in stocks, thereby increasing their value? In fact if pressed I&#039;d make the case that the stock market serves no real purpose and yields nothing like the benefits of the energy futures markets.
One other benefit...if you are Exxon Mobil and you can actually see oil prices out 2-3 years (there are actually forward price curves subject to transactional buying and selling  that go decades, done privately) and you are deciding to drill in the middle of the Pacific, where it is an extra USD 20/bbl to get the oil...would you drill it if you had zero way of hedging the gazillions you&#039;d spend? Or would you sit and let supply dry up, shortages and even maybe wars break out over the product, then drill? Even then you may not drill, making massive investments that are in brick and morter yet 100% speculative?
The net of the speculators participation, though they are risk takers, is to lower the risk for Exxon Mobil, and thus for you and me. It could be said that energy speculators are &quot;consumers&quot; of risk, removing it fom the complex.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I failed to mention that in the late 90&#8217;s when oil approached USD 10/bbl and gasoline dipped below a dollar in many places, it was these same speculators pressing downwards. Industry was losing billions, and they simply kept going. The point about them losing big then and winning big now is often made. I&#8217;m just adding that the net of all futures contracts in the energy complex during that time was massively short&#8230;more puts than calls, more longs than shorts. Today, speculators see supply demand factors, such as China trotting about sewing up more and more physical supplies, China, India, etc., all huge growing economies needing more and more oil, and in reality not a whole lot of extra supply coming (but talk of peak production is nonsense&#8230;it is peak at THESE economics and with this set of regulations), they also see wars and instabilities literally on top of the oil wells, etc. etc. and see being long the better bet. Micro moves up and down aside, they are dead correct in the macro and the net of all futures contracts these days will trend towrds the long side, more buyers than sellers.<br />
Speculators read the tea leaves and put money for mouth, thereby defining the market in exact terms based on best guess with all factors. To suggest they are a problem begs the comparison then of real estate speculators&#8230;and any speculator for that matter. Buying ever increasing home and real estate values on a bet creates artificial demand, meaning a family needn&#8217;t own all these homes&#8230;they are simply &#8220;for profit&#8221; purchases. Shall we regulate that as well? To my mind they aren&#8217;t making anymore land (except in Holland with ocean reclaim and new islands off Dubai&#8230;wink)<br />
so is it &#8220;fair&#8221; that those with cash can push up the price of this fundamental substance?<br />
Or the stock market&#8230;what about that? Is it bad the increases? Are the huge retirement funds and investment houses, 401k&#8217;s and mutuals doing a dirty deed by buying long positions in stocks, thereby increasing their value? In fact if pressed I&#8217;d make the case that the stock market serves no real purpose and yields nothing like the benefits of the energy futures markets.<br />
One other benefit&#8230;if you are Exxon Mobil and you can actually see oil prices out 2-3 years (there are actually forward price curves subject to transactional buying and selling  that go decades, done privately) and you are deciding to drill in the middle of the Pacific, where it is an extra USD 20/bbl to get the oil&#8230;would you drill it if you had zero way of hedging the gazillions you&#8217;d spend? Or would you sit and let supply dry up, shortages and even maybe wars break out over the product, then drill? Even then you may not drill, making massive investments that are in brick and morter yet 100% speculative?<br />
The net of the speculators participation, though they are risk takers, is to lower the risk for Exxon Mobil, and thus for you and me. It could be said that energy speculators are &#8220;consumers&#8221; of risk, removing it fom the complex.</p>
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		<title>By: David R. Usher</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77064</link>
		<dc:creator>David R. Usher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:41:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77064</guid>
		<description>NPR is not always wrong.  I have been interviewed on social issues many times by regional NPR stations.  Does that make me wrong?  No.  There is no news source that is always right or always wrong.

You can&#039;t believe everything you read in the news.  You have to look at the perspective and see if objective facts support the view.

NPR gets the bone because they were the first to report the issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>NPR is not always wrong.  I have been interviewed on social issues many times by regional NPR stations.  Does that make me wrong?  No.  There is no news source that is always right or always wrong.</p>
<p>You can&#8217;t believe everything you read in the news.  You have to look at the perspective and see if objective facts support the view.</p>
<p>NPR gets the bone because they were the first to report the issue.</p>
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		<title>By: thurston861</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77063</link>
		<dc:creator>thurston861</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:30:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77063</guid>
		<description>Cons! That was a lesson!  I hope to someday hear quite as much as you can muster in your experience. Not yet convinced of the value of these speculation markets, so your view appears opposite of mine.

Yes, Squiggy.  But Look out, you might be a pariha like me if you start considering the sources</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cons! That was a lesson!  I hope to someday hear quite as much as you can muster in your experience. Not yet convinced of the value of these speculation markets, so your view appears opposite of mine.</p>
<p>Yes, Squiggy.  But Look out, you might be a pariha like me if you start considering the sources</p>
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		<title>By: Squiggy</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77062</link>
		<dc:creator>Squiggy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:15:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77062</guid>
		<description>David Usher - I can&#039;t believe I&#039;m hearing you say this crap.  You just lost 90% of your credibility with me.  &lt;i&gt;NPR&lt;/i&gt;?  Come on.

conservativation - spot on.  Supposedly, no one wants a refinery in their backyard, so none have been built in decades.  I&#039;ll donate &lt;i&gt;my&lt;/i&gt; backyard, as long as they give me a cushy job.  Then maybe prices will start to moderate.  They actually are already beginning to fall, albeit not very much.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David Usher &#8211; I can&#8217;t believe I&#8217;m hearing you say this crap.  You just lost 90% of your credibility with me.  <i>NPR</i>?  Come on.</p>
<p>conservativation &#8211; spot on.  Supposedly, no one wants a refinery in their backyard, so none have been built in decades.  I&#8217;ll donate <i>my</i> backyard, as long as they give me a cushy job.  Then maybe prices will start to moderate.  They actually are already beginning to fall, albeit not very much.</p>
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		<title>By: S Baker</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77061</link>
		<dc:creator>S Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 17:49:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77061</guid>
		<description>The truth emerges from the conservative with experience in field operations of the oil industry. Thanks for the enlightening post.  The price I pay for energy is a small fraction of funds sent to the tax collectors. Furthermore, the price paid for bottled water is far higher than gasoline at the pump--where is the outcry? In my experience water has little energy value while the gasoline moves me rapidly down the road or through the air. Which is the better deal? If energy is the better deal, use it and invest in it.  Whining about companies making a profit is wasted energy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The truth emerges from the conservative with experience in field operations of the oil industry. Thanks for the enlightening post.  The price I pay for energy is a small fraction of funds sent to the tax collectors. Furthermore, the price paid for bottled water is far higher than gasoline at the pump&#8211;where is the outcry? In my experience water has little energy value while the gasoline moves me rapidly down the road or through the air. Which is the better deal? If energy is the better deal, use it and invest in it.  Whining about companies making a profit is wasted energy.</p>
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		<title>By: conservativation</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77060</link>
		<dc:creator>conservativation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 14:38:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77060</guid>
		<description>I had written a long response and the PC crashed…typical.

David this is my vocation (or was). I was a trader for 12 years, trading petrochemicals speculatively, benzene, toluene, xylene, and others all refinery based and crude oil cost driven. These have no official futures market though futures are traded by individuals creating them between the two companies involved. Most of this trade is physical, buying long, selling short, but always ultimately either receiving or delivering a barge of product. Geographic arbitrage, shipping the stuff between Asia, Europe, and here…al that. These trades are hedged using the energy complex on the MERC…futures contracts and all nature of derivatives.  Enron was a big player in my business as well as all the other stuff they did. In fact I was thankful in 1994 they offered me a job and I said no!
That to attempt to get standing on the matter….

In these physical trades manipulation is rampant, hoarding or massive short selling can push the market violently, and even here though, every few months if the speculators have been pushing counter to fundamentals of cost and supply demand, the market will reset and correct. Indeed that is occurring as we speak. Why do I mention this? Because crude oil is the textbook example of an efficient market the speculators cannot materially build and hold a premium in this market that is divorced for the realities of the market…its just too big and efficient. Further, without the ability to buy forward crude against future gasoline production or sell forward crude against future well production the market would be whipsaw insane…the futures market serves to smooth out what would be utter chaos. Imagine 1 barrel of oil and 3 buyers and no futures market…it’s a friggin auction. The futures market tempers this by offering a well defined and always available alternative if there is timing flexibility. Unlike physical product, there is theoretically infinite future contract oil available, it being a mere commitment that can simply match up and net out all on paper. The spot market and futures market reflect back and forth…that’s why it works.

On distillation (as you put it) or gasoline production and fuels, we are supply constrained here simply because of environmental and safety reasons…some reasonable some not…especially the ones making new green-field plants non-starters. As I write BP Texas City refinery is down because they had the explosion a couple years ago, and are so afraid that a flickering light bulb in a restroom sends them to the Off switch to make sure nobody gets hurt…every 3 letter government agency is permanently there. OSHA isn’t a small Wisconsin town.

The government is double minded, restricting drilling and refining while crying about lack of product…that’s the place to start. Allegations of and legislation regarding gouging will create chaotic price changes and shortages. I will never trust government to meddle in any way in the free marketplace…it is Pandora’s box defined.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had written a long response and the PC crashed…typical.</p>
<p>David this is my vocation (or was). I was a trader for 12 years, trading petrochemicals speculatively, benzene, toluene, xylene, and others all refinery based and crude oil cost driven. These have no official futures market though futures are traded by individuals creating them between the two companies involved. Most of this trade is physical, buying long, selling short, but always ultimately either receiving or delivering a barge of product. Geographic arbitrage, shipping the stuff between Asia, Europe, and here…al that. These trades are hedged using the energy complex on the MERC…futures contracts and all nature of derivatives.  Enron was a big player in my business as well as all the other stuff they did. In fact I was thankful in 1994 they offered me a job and I said no!<br />
That to attempt to get standing on the matter….</p>
<p>In these physical trades manipulation is rampant, hoarding or massive short selling can push the market violently, and even here though, every few months if the speculators have been pushing counter to fundamentals of cost and supply demand, the market will reset and correct. Indeed that is occurring as we speak. Why do I mention this? Because crude oil is the textbook example of an efficient market the speculators cannot materially build and hold a premium in this market that is divorced for the realities of the market…its just too big and efficient. Further, without the ability to buy forward crude against future gasoline production or sell forward crude against future well production the market would be whipsaw insane…the futures market serves to smooth out what would be utter chaos. Imagine 1 barrel of oil and 3 buyers and no futures market…it’s a friggin auction. The futures market tempers this by offering a well defined and always available alternative if there is timing flexibility. Unlike physical product, there is theoretically infinite future contract oil available, it being a mere commitment that can simply match up and net out all on paper. The spot market and futures market reflect back and forth…that’s why it works.</p>
<p>On distillation (as you put it) or gasoline production and fuels, we are supply constrained here simply because of environmental and safety reasons…some reasonable some not…especially the ones making new green-field plants non-starters. As I write BP Texas City refinery is down because they had the explosion a couple years ago, and are so afraid that a flickering light bulb in a restroom sends them to the Off switch to make sure nobody gets hurt…every 3 letter government agency is permanently there. OSHA isn’t a small Wisconsin town.</p>
<p>The government is double minded, restricting drilling and refining while crying about lack of product…that’s the place to start. Allegations of and legislation regarding gouging will create chaotic price changes and shortages. I will never trust government to meddle in any way in the free marketplace…it is Pandora’s box defined.</p>
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		<title>By: Joi</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/comment-page-1/#comment-77059</link>
		<dc:creator>Joi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 14:31:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/06/06/oil-price-gouging-from-enron-with-love/#comment-77059</guid>
		<description>Usher, this is one of the best articles you&#039;ve ever written. I knew something was up with the oil prices, no pun intended, but didn&#039;t realize it was this bad.


I guess we could go round and round about the corruption in government and companies, et al. But it might be easier to just say the their has just been a massive debasement of MORALS in today populace especially the leaders.

Proverbs 29:2 When the RIGHTEOUS are in authority, the people rejoice: but when the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Usher, this is one of the best articles you&#8217;ve ever written. I knew something was up with the oil prices, no pun intended, but didn&#8217;t realize it was this bad.</p>
<p>I guess we could go round and round about the corruption in government and companies, et al. But it might be easier to just say the their has just been a massive debasement of MORALS in today populace especially the leaders.</p>
<p>Proverbs 29:2 When the RIGHTEOUS are in authority, the people rejoice: but when the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn.</p>
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