To address Prof. Baskerville’s comments regarding ACFC

2007-09-08
By

 

It is with great regret that I read the words of Stephen Baskerville to the effect that the Emperor (ACFC) has no clothes.  I’ve seen this happen again and again over a period of 40 years.  Santayana said “Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.” 

Over a month ago I submitted the following article to The Liberator and to Transitions.  Not knowing whether they still intend to publish it, I submit that it is appropriate to put it forth at this time.

?????????????-

 

The Men’s/Fathers’ Movement:

 

As it exists and could be

 

 

 

Let’s face it, the men’s/fathers’ “movement” hasn’t moved in over 30 years.  Part of the reason is fierce opposition from entrenched government officials (judges, legislators, etc.) money-grubbing lawyers, feminists, SNAGS (sensitive, new age guys) and assorted other factions.  But a more damaging cause of our failure to achieve justice springs from within.  As Pogo famously said, “We have met the enemy, and he is us.”

 

I submit that intra-movement factionalism, egotistic ambitions and even the naiveté of newcomers are the root causes of our failure.  These suicidal phenomena have impeded progress right from the beginning.  Soon I expect to place an article on the sad history of the men’s/fathers’ movement on the Men’s Defense Assoc. website (See below).

 

This movement has many philosophies and aspects.  There are so many “organizations” I can’t keep track of them or their acronyms.  Some are one-man endeavors consisting of a pajama-clad zealot with a bedroom computer.  Others are nation-wide operations with talented and numerous followers.  They are by no means restricted to the United States.  Many of these groups are narrowly-focused, concentrating on single issues because they may have personal significance to the leader or leaders.  Examples of such single issues are divorce and child custody.

 

To address that example, I believe that father-bashing is but one aspect of a larger anti-male phenomenon, and that misandry (hatred of men) itself should be of greater concern.  I submit that pursuing single issues are unproductive approaches.  Fathers are but a subset of men, and alleviating fathers’ problems alone still leaves us with the underlying misandry, which will bite us again in another area.  It is like cutting off one head of a many-headed hydra.[1]  I submit that, in order to correct injustice or inequality directed at fathers or at men in general, the entire hydra must be attacked.

 

Many reform proposals have been posited over and over for the last 40 years, and the same speeches given.  Each suggestor and spokesman usually operating under the naive assumption his ideas are new and unique.  I believe that our movement has been bogged down for decades by debating minor issues and prematurely proposing various tactics, however excellent they may be.

 

I suggest it is imperative to determine philosophic Ends to which we can all agree before addressing Means of achieving those Ends.  As analogy, builders can’t build a long-lasting house without a foundation; neither can we build an effective movement without constituent groups agreeing on a common philosophy.  We must build the foundation of our movement before building upper storey rooms.  A common philosophy must be broad enough to include all reasonable approaches and narrow enough to exclude approaches that are actually harmful to that philosophy.

 

I have long proposed the following End: “To preserve the traditional nuclear family through restoration of equal dignity and equal (not identical) rights under the law for all male persons across a broad spectrum of life, including divorce, employment, health, crime punishment and image.”  Anything essentially similar to this will do.  What must be avoided is endless arguments over trivialities – how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.  Whatever End is eventually chosen, it must precede debating or proposing Means to that End.  Without such an understanding of Ends, we cannot know who we are – and who we aren’t.

 

The anti-male phenomenon and its gestalt are so massive and intricate, ranging from the obvious to the subtle, that neophyte would-be reformers with limited experience, however brilliant they may be or imagine themselves to be, cannot fathom the problems and solutions.  In the interest of broadening the base of the movement and making it more acceptable to the public at large, it may be necessary to include elements primarily concerned with issues of health and personal growth – or introspection, elements not primarily concerned with external discrimination against men and fathers.  That, of course, is a matter for consideration by the mainstream.

 

Our philosophical differences are not as great as personal ones.  Egotism is a huge problem.  Some “leaders” fancy themselves the Messiah, and would sacrifice the movement itself in pursuit of leadership.  Every barnyard rooster is king on his own dung heap.  Taking a clue from Lucifer in Milton’s Paradise Lost, the motivating principle of some seems to be “Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.” Former activist Ken Pangborn describes it as “the Fidel Castro syndrome,” meaning there can be only one Revolutionary hero.  Consequently, many reform organizations have been parochial and militantly independent.  They have even been compared to a circular firing squad.  Historically, we have been unable or unwilling to choose leaders of that firing squad, persons who could reform the ranks from a circle into a line, a firing line facing actual enemies.

 

There is enough talent and resources dispersed throughout the men’s/fathers’ movement, internationally, to successfully confront the enemies of justice if those talents and resources can be properly coordinated.  If we ever mature to the point of shedding egotism and agreeing on an End that all our disparate, legitimate elements can accept, we can then marshal these resources and talents.  In order to know what’s going on beyond our little circles, to know where to direct our attentions and activities, we must be fully educated on issues.  Therefore, the resources mentioned above should include worldwide common information forums such as The Liberator or Transitions and a website, perhaps modification of an existing one.

 

The internet has potential to greatly enhance communication, despite the many pips squeaking therein.  The numerous tangential subjects addressed on movement blogsites are an example.

 

Such a combination of forces and resources would be overwhelming, constituting a force equivalent to or greater than that of feminism.  The resultant “Manpower” would create the political clout necessary to achieve the goal all of us so desperately need.

 

Of course, a juggernaught like this is more easily conceived than constructed.  In theory, if the aforesaid internal problems could be overcome, the best and most efficient construct would consist of a unified organization with democratically-elected leaders chosen from the most capable.  Men’s Equality Now (MEN) International, the last credible attempt to so unify the movement, came to naught.  So practically, in view of situational reality, the most we can probably hope for at present is a greater degree of cooperation among major existing groups.

 

I would urge the top leadership of ACFC and NCFC, perhaps even CRC and the Men’s Health Network (there may also be others of significance) to resolve to pursue intra-movement cooperation.  If these several large ? relatively speaking ? coalitions seriously act in concert, and movement writers take up the cause, the smaller groups should be swept along like lifeboats in the wake of the Queen Mary.  Sure there will be the usual nitpickers and ankle-biters, but their influence would be minimized.

 

As probably the longest-serving living activist, I would be willing to serve in any supportive or coordinating, but non-administrative, capacity current leaders might choose.

 

For anyone desirous of further studying the problems and solutions, I recommend the book “Save the Males” (5th revision in the works), a compilation of many years studying these issues.  It is described in detail at www.mensdefense.org.

 

 

Richard F. Doyle, Editor Emeritus, The Liberator

 

 

________________________________

 

[1] A monster in Greek mythology that had nine heads and was killed by Hercules.  When one head was cut off, another grew instantly in its place.

 

 

 

20 views

  • college activist

    Mr. Doyle..Thank you sir for youre insight!!

    We list youre book second only to Warren Farrel’s “The Myth” in our activist most recommended reads!!

    I see the main problem is the lack of awareness among the average guy to the reality that there are even mensrights activist groups around!!
    The main stream media..and their “lace curtain” can now be easilly circumvented with the internet, and our cause should be progressing quite steadilly…

    There needs to be a major reach out campaign…and the media that refuse to give mens issues any airtime should be held accounteable!!!

    Men can painlessly start right now to raise awareness by sending links to their friends showing various web sites…say for instance…” hey check this out..you might find this interesting!!”

  • anti armchair generals

    Richar Doyle,
    Like Moses.” your eyes have seen the promised land” but after 40 years trying, you will not get there. Neither will I, after agout 30 years of activism, after losing all hope untill I began to read your publication The Liberator.
    “Victory has thousand fathers, but defeat is an orphan” attribute to former President Kennedy, but coned much earlier.
    But at least mens movement stopped feminist from turning back from their main goal “Overthrowing capitalism is too easy for us, but we must overthrowing the (bleeping) patriarchy.
    Feminist have no Army, but the activist have “parachuted” behing the lines and infiltrated most legislative, judicial and executive branches. Then their have organizations of their own, as demonstated in numerous lawsuits under Title IX. Men only have few shoestring operations
    Mike LaSalle in electronic age can reach masses with MND,

  • Robert Stevens

    The key to victory in this struggle is a simple , but tough solution. The only way to do serious damage to the entrenced opposition is to cut off the money,power and control. Once that ” serious damage” is done alot of the bickering and struggling for control will stop. All the groups who are involved in this movement will finally band together. Someone will emerge as the undisputed leader. Someone everyone or most everyone will follow. Kind of like a Martin Luther King of the fathers movement. Several people before MLK tried to get the civil rights movement going, but failed. But somehow MLK figured out how to suceed.
    We need something similiar. Once this ” superman” shows up and whalops the GiSKERS( government sponsored kidnapping and extortion racket) Everyone will make a mad dash to get behind this guy. That’s what we need!
    After that miracleous event We will finally have a real fathers/mens rights movement going and nothing is likely to stop it. oh.. they will try, but they are out numbered and out gunned, they are going to lose!

  • http://www.decriminalizefatherhood.com DcFather

    Wouldn’t it be nice if the entire “movement” unified into a single fast-growing group?

    Me, I’m just one of those zealots doing what I can from a bedroom computer, and I’m sure what I propose is not totally original, but I have skills, time, dedication, and money, (along with two children I haven’t spoken to in six years) I’m wishing to channel towards success, so here is my two cents worth:

    We need our proven leaders to unite on a unification plan. If proven leaders got together and worked out and agreed upon a unification plan, I would gladly follow whatever they agree upon, devoting whatever I can towards its success.

    Such a unification plan would not scold newbies for naivete, but would channel their interest and concern towards becoming knowledgeable, productive, useful, and helpful. It would ask members what sort of skills, time, and effort and money they can contribute, and call upon them to do so.

    Likewise, it could not depend solely on one person. I could easily name ten names I would follow if they were in agreement. A few of them not getting what they wanted and dropping out may hurt but would not lessen my support.

    Rather than naming any of those names, can we agree that we need a first Continental Congress of sorts. Maybe we could nominate and elect them online, and ask the top vote getters to get together, and the rest of us to support them, even if a few of them are unwilling or back out.

    I think the scope of the unified organization would parallel its organizational structure. Surely we can always use one more person writing to their newspaper or legislator, so there is no such thing as a member with nothing to contribute. Maybe there would be a recruiting division, a fundraising division, a college activism division, a division devoted to equal parenting, a group focused on anti-father advertising, a media relations division, and so on. Each division could have its own elected leader, and there could be minimum requirements one must meet to be a part of that division. A person could be a part of as many divisions they are willing to meet minimum requirements, but there could also be a “supporter” division that requires almost nothing.

    We could vote on everything from the name of the organization to its specific purpose. We must be able to establish a goal, and channel all energy and focus towards achieving that goal, including full support by those who prefer a different goal. Goals could start small, and grow with proven success. For example, to make politicians think twice before spouting the old “deadbeat dad” mantra might be a year-long goal in the beginning, but hopefully would be a smaller goal as our success grows.

    Constructive criticism must be welcomed, but criticism without suggested corrective action should be discouraged. In that spirit, I ask any subsequent posters to contribute something contstructive instead of just telling me what’s been tried before or what’s wrong with my suggestions.

  • anti armchair generals

    When some women claimed that they were sexually assulted at Univ of Colorado
    recruitment party feminist district attorney and media went into a feeding frenzy,
    similar to Mike Nifong case at Duke Univeristy. The District Court dismissed the case and a journalist wrote a book “Bufffaloed” how media and other made mountains out of molehill. But two publishers backed out after threatened with a lawsuit. So he self-published it. Now the 10th Circuit has reinstated the case. If you have a pdf format, just read the Amicus Curiae list for women in the beginning. Then one realizes what kind of network (or part) feminist have.

    http://www.ca10.uscourts.gov/opinions/06/06-1184.pdf

  • anti armchair generals

    Link to newspaper Daily Camera” report how media manipulated the CU case and the Plaintiff’s attrneys threat to sue (The Attorney is married to Board of Refents
    member at Colorao University,

    http://www.dailycamera.com/bdc/buffzone_news/article/0,1713,BDC_2448_3838932,00.html

  • Jim Peterson

    What I see wrong with the MRM is the failure so far to hang together with other men with other issues and the deep desire to, therefore, hang separately. Obviously, if ACFC got to a point where they could not talk about other men’s rights issues (including other father’s rights issues), even when talking about them would prove misandry is a problem…then they were doomed to failure.

    This is beginning to change.

    Leaders like Dave Usher, Marc Rudov and Glenn Sacks have noticed that any major form of misandry in the USA needs to be exposed in order to prove to everyone who listens that there is an overarching “problem” whose symptoms rain down on the concept of “shared parenting” along with a dozen other major concepts.

    If one attacks misandry on a broad front, one can make the public more aware that there really is a misandry problem to begin with.

    Think of issues like ants. One ant will get eaten by the anteater. But 1000 ants can carry the anteater over the cliff. So the trick is to find 1000 instances of anti-male bias and use all of them to destroy feminism in the US, preferably with a number of parallel Pro Se challenges in the federal courts claiming, for instance, that domestic violence is a matter for states to decide and not something for the federal government, while also claiming that men do actually have Constitutional rights on the federal level.

    I see a new “cause” develop every day. Just today it turned out that the missing British girl “Madeleine” was not carried off by a middle aged white male as the parents had suggested…the child was probably killed by the parents themselves who figured they could easily finger a middle aged white male.

    We have 5 Conservative Supreme Court justices who will support us if we can only convince them that it is FEMINISM and MISANDRY that we are fighting and not something that conservative judges might find boring like “shared parenting”. If faced with a valid “misandry and feminism has gone too far” case, these 5 justices can, in one fell swoop, overrule hundreds of anti-male judges below them. We just need a case go get to them via a conduit of a pro-male judge that we find at the district level by not paying lawyers too much money to launch just one or two cases…but instead to have a dozen men launch pro se (lawyerless) challenges as probes to find the right judge.

    Believe me, the enemy goes “judge shopping” in this manner.

    Now how does one go about expanding the MRM to have a broader message that cannot be ignored as a whole? Well, we are doing that right here at MND.

    Last Christmas I decided that the small group of men and women fighting the IMBRA law (forced background checks for men wishing to say hello to a foreign woman online) were NOT going to get a big movement going without allying with other groups. The reason was because only 0.4% of Americans socialize with foreigners and people were too dumb to see that, if IMBRA is upheld in the courts, the actions of American males on all social websites will be regulated within a few years.

    I decided to talk on the phone with Dave Usher on and off for about six weeks.

    Dave understood that divorced men not only had the issues of dealing with feminist ex-wives in terms of parenting and financial bondage…these men, and never-married men, needed to keep the available options of being able to find OTHER WIVES who might be more appropriate…without feminists daring to actually BLOCK THE ATTEMPTS of these men to find other wives.

    He saw the IMBRA law as being integrally tied with the father’s rights movement in that divorced fathers were being prevented from remarrying…which would take money out of the reach of the greedy ex-wife’s lawyers. Usher saw IMBRA and VAWA as part and parcel the same thing: the US Congress was vindictively passing laws to keep men from the pursuit of happiness.

    But I instinctively knew that Dave was getting some resistance from his peers at http://www.mediaradar.org as to whether to come out with a public opinion on IMBRA, presumably because the father’s rights movement could be “ridiculed” by being associated with so-called “losers who seek mail order brides”.

    I remember feeling “Men are their own worst enemies. They allow themselves to be divided and conquered by feminists who create stigmas on various and supposed subgroups of men and cause them to repel each other the way nerds in high school often ignore each other”.

    But Dave was on our side and finally came through with the following article that was prominently displayed on the MediaRadar website:

    http://www.newswithviews.com/Usher/david47.htm

    With the above, widely published article, Dave Usher had broken a barrier and made history by expanding the concept of what a men’s rights group should be standing up for and against.

    With this one article, Dave Usher also noted that DIVORCED DADS HAVE THE RIGHT to find a better wife in any way they want and to start anew, preferably with their kids enjoying a great new mom.

    After speaking with Dave Usher, I concentrated on convincing Glenn Sacks that IMBRA was about as anti-male as any law the US Congress had ever passed and directly related to the pain that a divorced man goes through. Glenn had been concentrating on the child custody issues and it took some convincing, but then he decided to post an Online Dating Rights advertisement on every newsletter he sends out and he wrote several articles, one of which is at this link:

    http://glennsacks.com/blog/index.php?tag=international-dating

    Then I looked at the NoNonsenseman, Marc Rudov, who was starting to appear weekly on Fox News condemning feminists for being hypocrites and needing laws to tilt the balance of power in their favor in a zero sum game with men. I talked to Marc on the phone for hours. Finally he realized that IMBRA was a major men’s rights issue and he published the following:

    http://thenononsenseman.mensnewsdaily.com/2007/05/13/unhook-that-bra/

    Now Marc Rudov has expanded into being on CNN where he just attacked the State of Virginia’s anti-male billboard campaign against men who hold hands with their children:

    http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2007/09/05/intv.war.on.men.CNN

    Why can’t the father’s rights movement get that aggressive and confrontational?

    Note how he does well on Television saying that Alimony needs to be totally banned. Women respect it when men really fight as opposed to negotiate:

    http://ktla.trb.com/news/local/video/ktla-video-markrudov,0,7044902.htmlstory

    My point is that the only really effective Men’s Rights organization is going to have at least as broad as agenda as the NOW. We need to get millions of men interested, even if we have to get the pro-porn men on our side against the feminists and evangelists who want to make damned sure we cannot even look at women, much less speak with them.

  • mruffolo

    It’s not all doom and gloom.

    The Wall Steet Journal recently published “Avoiding Kids: How Men Cope
    With Being Cast as Predators”, a second article about men’s rights.

    “…our society, while declining to profile by race or nationality when it comes to crime and terrorism, has become nonchalant about profiling men. Child advocates are advising parents never to hire male babysitters. Airlines are placing unaccompanied minors with female passengers.

    Child-welfare groups say these precautions minimize risks. But men’s rights activists argue that our societal focus on “bad guys” has led to an overconfidence in women. (Children who die of physical abuse are more often victims of female perpetrators, usually mothers, according to the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services.)”

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118903209653018615.html?mod=mostpop

    Last month, the author wrote about how our culture teaches children to fear men and “hundreds of men responded” to his article. Most giving examples of por treatment by women.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118782905698506010.html?mod=Moving-On

    Email: Jeffrey.Zaslow @ wsj.com

  • ptbarnum

    Speak quickly, gentlemen.

    And archive your comments and conversations here.

    Because Mike LaSalle is going to do away with all comments on MND in the very near future.

    Welcome to Men’s Newz Ditzy!

  • conservativation

    Unification is like “raising awareness”….words we like to use, lacking teeth though, lacking action. Agreed tnhat a lot of individuals writing and complaining cannot change much, but an amorphous blob of similar minded men would not accomplish anything. The problems are too specific to just march and chant “mens rights now!”.

  • mruffolo

    Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2007 14:07:22

    From: “Zaslow, Jeff”

    To: “Mark Ruffolo”

    Many thanks for your response to my column about men
    feeling cast as predators. As you might imagine, I was inundated with very
    passionate and heartfelt responses from both men and women. I do feel
    this is a topic that could certainly use more exploration.

    Up the road, I hope to do another follow-up. So I’m
    printing out your email and may be in touch then. In the meantime, if you’re
    interested in how other people are responding to this issue, check out
    the link below to our wsj.com discussion forum. It’s been pretty active
    since my column ran last Thursday. You’ll see a lot of passion, anger
    and calls for activism.

    http://forums.wsj.com/viewtopic.php?t=756

    Thanks again for writing.

    All the best,

    Jeffrey Zaslow

    The Wall Street Journal

    2000 Town Center, Suite 750

    Southfield, Mich. 48075

    Jeffrey.Zaslow@wsj.com

    248-204-5514

  • BobV01

    Mr. Doyle gives rebirth to some important concepts. At the onset it should be mentioned that Victor Smith is alive and may be the longest lasting advocate. The Rally/ Family Preservationist/ ACFC Open letter discussion might even reinforce some of Mr. Doyle’s possible recommendations while at the same time pointing out some dangers.
    During the Rally teleconferences several attempts were made, by myself, to suggest solution orientation, possibilities under DRA 2005, and a call to Father, it would seem those comments may have been by passed, and instead, the Family Preservation thought emerged.
    There are ongoing efforts, today, attempting to elevate awareness and support men and fathers: Wikipedia definitions, efforts to stop US HRR 590, US SNB 1626, NFI’s 2006 Grants et al.
    A collective philosophy might well retain our history, current events and resources. decentric operations might well counter the Misandry Caucuses’ decentric operations.
    Given DRA 2005, not widely recognized, until perhaps this past weekend: we may have taken our eye of the ball. A wider discussion is probably appropriate.

  • roadkill1965

    Issues are won with appeals to the heart, not to the head. Just as in politics, people will say that they support a candidate every day up til the time they step into the booth, then they’ll vote for someone completely different, based on their “gut feeling.” In other words, we must appeal to peoples’ emotions, not their intellect. I bet the Will Smith movie “The pursuit of happyness” had more of a positive impact on this movement than a year’s worth of letter writing to senators and representatives. We can quote statistics and cite facts all day long, but that doesn’t move peoples’ hearts. All those male-bashing commercials and shows about predators and abusers give people the impression that most men are like that, despite what statistics actually show. Unfortunately, it’s the IMPRESSION that’s important, not the actual facts. I believe the mens’ movement will never gain ground until we start seeing commercials, shows, and movies that generate sympathy for our issues.

  • RichardMBadger

    Dr. Baskerville, I have a great respect for your work.

    Your article “Is There Really a Fatherhood Crisis?” allowed me to validate much of what my arguments and advocacy was all about.

    When you speak about the ACFC, my interpretation is that this letter is written from true heartfelt pain and concern. There is so much promise that the ACFC has, and it is up to us the fathers that are going through the many struggles that must communicate our position for ACFC. Although, I have only recently become a member of ACFC, I have been following the work of the organization for many years. I am currently looking at starting an affiliate organization in Milwaukee, WI, but now, I may need to rethink my position on that?

    I would hope that the leadership aside from Dr. Baskerville would read the comments, feel the conviction and sense the pain and frustration of the men that have taken the time to not only read the letter, but to post their comments.

    Lastly, I would urge that we not fight amongst ourselves, but instead support one another. I know that many of us are frustrated beyond belief, and I believe that it is this frustration that is conveyed in too many of the comments. I have tried to take a less abrasive approach to all of this, and recognize my war as me vs the System, and not me vs her.

    It is with great hope that the leadership of the ACFC review their current practices and incorporate some new and innovative approaches to this issue. The need is great, the emotions are high, the stakes (children) are even higher, and there are a lot of great fathers counting on the success of you.

    Feel free to contact me directly for future dialogue.

    One Brother in the Struggle!

    Richard M. Badger

  • conservativation

    Roadkill…EXACTLY! All the procedural crap and studies and votes and marches and conferences will never amount to a thing…We were beaten by emotion, we must counter attack with emotion.






Search