Ask Dr. Helen: Should Men Get Married?

No reason to incur those financial, emotional, and social risks inherent to marriage for men when there are zero benefits for men that are unique to marriage.

Men can love, have sex with, be a companion, do literally ANYTHING with a woman without incurring the risks of marriage that they can with that piece of paper.

It has been pointed out again and again how so many women begin to behave differently after they marry, particularly in their attitudes toward those men that they married.

Those women did not actually “change”; the fact is that their “bait and switch” gambit worked…. and they no longer had any incentive to carry on the ruse after the wedding.

When men begin to receive equal rights, and there actually ARE unique benefits to marrying, then men ought to consider marriage as a serious option.

Until then, it’s Russian Roulette, with three or four loaded cylinders……

At the risk of being repetitious, I’ll repeat what I have said so often here before.
American women have a bad case of ego inflation and entitlement. They have no sense that thye have any part in a marriage break-up. They are only “heroic victims.
American men have no role models for setting limits on women either because they have internalized the feminist nonsense or because they have had strong male role models like “Frankly, my dear, I don’t give a damn!” Clark Gable or John Wayne.
And why is Dr Helen telling men about their rights at a men’s web-site?
Nothing personal, Dr Helen, but it is peculiar that there is a female anchor at Fox baseball but no men on “The View”.

you are correct. there is no male role model these days. the ’strong’ (and good) role models of the past would be prosecuted for domestic violence. so now we live with women that have the right to abuse their men and if the men respond in kind, they are thrown in jail and barred from their own home.

isn’t that a fine kettle of fish?

….only the poor and un-educated are getting married in this openlly male hostile environment!!

If women ask you ..”where have all the good men gone??”…

Well babes…you just kept taking, and taking, and demanding even more and more..until youve just priced youreself out of the market!!

The most stupid, ill-educated and nasty woman can rubbish the nicest, kindest and most intelligent man and no one protests. “Men seem to be so cowed that they can’t fight back, and it is time they did.” Doris Lessing

Doris Doris Doris… you are so smart, but as dilber says, everyone can be stupid sometimes (especially the smart).

The nicest kindest and most intelligent man knows that the minute he gives her the whatfor, or touches her, he goes from a monster practice dummy, to a monster that has to be destroyed. Whats more is that the rest of the nicest, kindest, and intelligent men will do the job for her.

What would you suggest such a man do? haul off and give a whack? Go running around and whining like some little twaddle, and say “she’s being mean?”

Doris. The truth is that this is YOUR battle… the men cant… like old times you can only fight fire with fire… and men do not fight the way women do, which is why we actually fight, its out in the open, and the result ends up resolving an issue AND in the eyes of everyone else restore some peace. However, the machinations of women who want power (agripina comes to mind, as does most of the intriguing stories of women of power in the past), are the kinds of things that make everyone paranoid and distrust everyone. No one knows who is saying what outside of site, no one knows if something was done passive aggressively, or it was a convenient accident. Nothing is on the up and up, not even the style of debate!! (which is nothing but the same tactics of the nazi brown shirts supporting Hitler to elected office).

Martin Luther King: “Freedom is never voluntarily given by the oppressor, it must be demanded by the oppressed.”

Ah, that might be good in a FREE STATE, but since the women of the 60s revolution have had their way, we are a lot more totalitarian.

James Watson told the truth… What happened to that noble prize winner?

L Summers of Harvard, son of a female mathematician told the truth, what happened to him, and what happened to the school?

Shall we list out the litany of men and people that have stood up for the truth?

And who shall we protest to? The state? The women? Its like protesting to stalin that the gulag isn’t heated enough.. it like being a kulak and begging a bit of bread from the party member..

However, here is the result of your comment. Do you really wish for the men to rise up like the militant blacks and other oppressed people of the past? Lets see. Care to list out the lynchings in the south? How about the retaliations the other way around?

Guess what? the men of other states ARE doing that… islamics are protesting.. and they are gang raping women to put htem in their place…

Is that what you mean? The men should rise up and put women back into their place?

Helen, you are not thinking things through, since you are applying a theory of racism, to the concept of gender class Marxism. The black and white of the dark south didn’t live in the same house together… those marching for the cause, didn’t have to come home and sleep peaceably with the enemy…

And that’s the problem you don’t get… the men don’t want to war against their mates. And you are saying, that if we are oppressed we must enjoin the battle… but if we do, we know there will be no chance of anything left!!!

A forcibly defeated enemy must be vanquished (exterminated), not to be a problem again. While that is not politically correct, any one want to list out histories lessons on that subject?

The other side you end up not addressing is that this leadership is communist socialist. That they are getting help, using tactics, and things from a movement that was designed to topple capitalism.. And many of the men are on the same socialist page, even if they aren’t on the page of feminist gender warfare.

Have you not seen the situations of men that DID respond to their oppressors?

There was that guy that took an automatic weapon to the court house… how many died including the ex wife?

Then there was the guy that crashed his plane with daughter as passenger into the mother in laws house.

The guys here could list out a long line of incidents related to such court situations.

Here is one… Osama bin Laden and Al queada commit atrocities in multiples… the reason is clear to a strategist or tactician. One bomb, or incident can be coulded with doubt and such… but two of the same things at the same time in more than one place CANT be covered up.

And so again… what do you want us to do?

Hard to go protest when you cant earn enough money to stay out of jail..

Hard to do things when any wrong response will result in the lost of contact with your children..

I ask… would the oppressed Africans that you refer to protesting… would they have protested and marched if the enemy they were protesting had their children as hostage?

And referring to the marriage strike… well ever think that the idea was to get the population so low, that another state can cause a war, stretch us too thin, and then take everything?

What while the men and women are fighting, someone else will take their rights, their homes, their property.. And make them cattle and chattel for the state?

This again is not the same as the men who marched in the civil rights era.. (take a look at the crowds).. they knew that their wives would take care of the kids if something happened to them… they knew that while they were marching, the people they were against didn’t have their children in arms…(and the backing of a super power state)

consider a prenuptial agreement that can serve to protect you should a divorce become a reality.

I suspect your going to get a lot on this one.. if the marriage contract is one way.. and feminine jurisprudence is that a contract not be binding to a woman if she doesn’t want it, and the support of the courts on that… what good is that?

Care to cruise the womens sites to see how they are advised to handle it? ever notice that women can have their own spaces, but men cant? That way women can monitor men.. cant have a revolution if you cant meet freely.

Despite their enforceability, a premarital agreement can be set aside for fraud, duress, failure to disclose, unfairness, and failure to be adequately represented. Both sides should have independent legal counsel to advise them in the drafting and review of the prenuptial agreement. An experienced family law attorney can help you define your short-term and long-term goals in reaching an agreement with your fiancé. http://carolinafamilylaw.com/premarital_agreement.html

You realize that that’s not a thing that most people can afford? That the need for the wife to get a lawyer and start a battle before the wedding, is not conducive?

And of course… take a look at the list of ways to break it… it amounts to how clever your lawyer is at showing those things.

If a woman can attack and kill a incapacitated man.. or run over a man several times.. and there is a feminist program run by judges (go check it out) to free them after conviction. That all one has to do is claim spousal abuse (which they would anyway), and the pre nupt is dead on duress grounds.. if you do it yourself with her together.. then its failure to get her a lawyer (the guy is plum out of luck). In fact, she can legally commit fraud, which couild dissolve the nuptial that would clip her! Whether they work or not depends on the ruthlessness of the manipulating person your with..

Helen, its time to start reading those extreme stories, and realize that they are not extreme.. that they are not one offs, and that they are par for the course… it’s the difference in believing apartheid happened or not, that holocaust happened or not, and that gulag system happened or not.. while those are extreme examples, it’s the same extreme that makes everyone not believe it eventually.. that the difference between their mental image of women, and other institutions, cant cope with the dissonance, that these extreme things are not extreme but common, and whats extreme is that you hear about them.

I am sorry this is so long.. and it’s not the question your request.. because what your asking and such, and the article states.. will lead no where…

The very question that was on the table when it started, you passed on to those who have already flooded you with answers.

The sad part.. and I can phrase it as a question.

Dr, Helen:
When the sisters of spin, the hellacious harpies, and the fellow travelers and useful idiots turn towards you, what will you do? What will you do when your syndications start getting letters and they start dropping you?

You have come out against the party, and these are totalitarian socialists we are talking about. The old ones cut their teeth in the labor movement and with cpusa…

“Feminism, Socialism, and Communism are one in the same, and Socialist/Communist government is the goal of feminism.” – Catharine A. MacKinnon, Toward a Feminist Theory of the State (First Harvard University Press, 1989), p.10

You realize who she is, no?

“A world where men and women would be equal is easy to visualize, for that precisely is what the Soviet Revolution promised.” – Simone de Beauvoir, The Second Sex (New York, Random House, 1952), p.806

Your not stepping into a small skirmish between men and women..

You’re stepping into the middle of the crowbar that was designed to destroy the culture of America, and make it so unhappy that it will believe communist socialism is the way to go… (That the idea is to run everything into the ground.. so that the misery of socialism would be less than the misery of capitalism.. Read the mens comments in forums and such. MANY of them are already calling and wishing for the fall to hurry up and come along!!!)

I would also suggest that you read about critical theory..

A necessary tool for Critical Theorists is the Agent Provocateur, for without someone starting the argument, Critical Theory never begins. A conflict must be started for the plan of Critical Theory to be implemented.

Right now your acting as the agent provacature since you avoided the question and threw it back.. and are criticizing without offering any solution.

idea behind Critical Theory is to use criticism to destroy by continual division.

Critisizing the men for not protesting their oppresors and such, helps divide us.. there is no way to turn the men into a entrenched ideological mass in opposition to the female one, and EVER have it dissolve again… the conceptual is to create the female side while holding down the men… and now, they will create the permanent male side, by letting go of the holding back of the men, and instigate protest and entrenchment.

After that… society will never agaiu be populous enough, cultured enough, and cohesive enough to throw off their chains…

The men are already getting apathetic… and one cant feel their chains, unless one moves. And if one cant throw off their chains, then apathy and nihilism is the only way to feel free while being chained down.

A bit of food for thought.

Men have the power until they say ‘I Do.’ Once they do that, the state takes over and it is all over for the poor schlub. Men dont need to be married..women do….

“Should Men Get Married?”

Um, no.

#5 Artfldgr.

So very nice to see that the victim mentality is alive and well in this thread.

‘Tis always someone elses fault. Never would you change for the worse.

Try looking at yourselves objectively, and start taking accountability for your own actions, and you might see that the future is not as bleak as you portray it to be.

“So back to the question of should men get married? I say, do so with an open mind and realize that the legal system may be stacked against you. ”

MAY BE? You are joking right?

TMOTS

Re post #9…I see the “blame the victim” mentality is alive and well.

The future is just about exactly as bleak as protrayed in these posts, perhaps more so, thanks to legally gender biased practices such as the “The Tender Years Doctrine” and the Social Security Act, Title 4, among others.

family lawyer: “So very nice to see that the victim mentality is alive and well in this thread.
‘Tis always someone elses fault. Never would you change for the worse.
Try looking at yourselves objectively, and start taking accountability for your own actions, and you might see that the future is not as bleak as you portray it to be.”

fourthwire: family lawyer, please feel free to re-insert your head into your rectum, since you’re obviously comfortable in that position, with plenty of practice keeping it there.

While you were “away” participating in inhaling your own rectal fumes over an extended period, men’s social, reproductive, and legal rights were being raped……. making it unnecessarily risky to marry….. except for those men who don’t mind paying for homes that they might not be able to live in, paying child support for children that they might not be able to see, and paying for the past use of a vagina, long after that vagina is engaged in activity with other men’s penises.

Now I realize that you might not be the brightest of primates, what with your grey cells chronically deprived of oxygen, but try actually READING a bit more of the featured stories and blogs here on MND……..

….. or better yet, have an ADULT read them for you.

FamilyLawyer, how are you coming on that essay showing that court ordered coercion of labor to pay child support is not a violation of the Antipeonage Act?

I will remind you that in my State, Washington, RCW 26.09.080, 090, and 100 provide that property division, spousal support and child support be determined WITHOUT REGARD TO MARITAL MISCONDUCT.

No-fault divorce. It does not MATTER whether it is my fault or somebody else’s. It does not MATTER what I do other than to pay the EXTORTION.

In criminal law, imagine if it did not MATTER whether the defendant committed the crime, he is automatically sentenced to peonage under threat of imprisonment anyway.

NOW can you see the problem?

Judges regularly set aside prenuptial agreements in divorces where children are involved.

It goes back to that meaningless and undefineable phrase “best interests of the child” which is really only relevent if mommy gets more stuff and money.

Somehow, Mommy shouldn’t have to give up her club membership if she tosses the fella that pays for it, but it’s ok if Dad lives in a hovel and eats ramen noodles for weeks on end while she takes the kids to Disney for a vacation.

You’re a fool if you’re a man and get married.

Ever notice the number of “How to Find a Man” books as compared to the “How to Find a Wife” books.(if there are any.)
Men have power, lots of it but we don’t know how to use it and are also reluctant to use it.
The candidacy of Hilary Clinton is a significant point in male-female relationships, not because she is a woman be because she is a deceitful, under-handed—what’s that word that rhymes with witch?
Assuming she gets the Democratic nomination, the Republican candidate has to go after her like a tiger. And if she dares to start that “How dare you talk to a woman like that” nonsense, she should be laughed off the stage.
She has already tried that maneuver after the debate in Philadelphia by talking about “ganging up on a girl” when she spoke at Wellesley, her alma mater. Front-runners are always ganged up on.
One urban legend that has to be demolished is the traditional American belief that women are angels started by Lincoln and continued on through Nixon.
American women wanted equality. Chivalry and romance are not part of equality; they are only ways to control men.
Enough.

FamilyLawyer #9, had I time and had I not run out of patience with turds I would argue with you. But come the day when I am President, take a snap of your smile as it will soon disappear, along with your teeth. Jokers like you continue to take the pisss along with your misery-rent but your time will come.

Son to his father

“How much does it cost to get married dad?”

Father; ” I dont know son, I’m still paying for it!”

If as men and fathers we can’t return our judicial system to sanity….Then the insanity of our judicial sytem will return all by itself….by destroying western civilization!!

I think we need to keep in mind that people like FamilyLawyer are profiting tremendously from the current system. It’s not a surprise, then, that he thinks the system doesn’t need fixing.

Artfldgr – “Hard to do things when any wrong response will result in the lost of contact with your children.. ”

Ahh, the fear factor. There are things we can do, but yes, there is a risk. What is the risk if you do nothing? Seems to be about the same. Leave the lawyers out of the battle and pick up a law book yourself. See http://www.citizensrule.org for a suggestion on self-help. We are not going to change anything until we educate ourselves, and the lawyers will tag along for the scraps. If any still have some balls, they’ll help us out.

fourthwire – Pretty harsh. Not knowing how familylawyer plays the game, I’ll reserve judgment for now. I think he just needs a refresher course in due process, if they still offer the class.

familylawyer,
If they no longer offer the class, I’d be happy to help you out.

Ahh, the fear factor. There are things we can do, but yes, there is a risk. What is the risk if you do nothing? Seems to be about the same.

NOT BY A LONG SHOT…

I can tell right now that you have never been in the situation.

each contact is a potential for mischief…

in my case, after she faked her murder and destroyed my career and pulled lots of stunts… it was a mess… however when i went to pick my son up for visitation, another woman, who was also battling the state (her husband was put in jail on false charges instigated by her family, she was never a part of it). she learned a lot, and so she helped. each time i had to go near the place where my son was. i would park up the block and this woman would go to pick him up. ZERO contact.
[NEVER enter the apartment or house and such, even to just discuss anything!]

since the person who she was with was an state employee who worked for the department of social services, she was getting the best systemic advice you could get. (this woman was a psychopath, was abused, i could go on for days).

well, during this period, my ex locked her self out… and so she went around back and proceeded to climb through a window. the window was not in good repair, and was often propped open to allow the cats to freely go in and out (which is why my son almost died of sepsis, another long story). well, as she was getting herself through the window she knocked out the stick supporting it, and it came down full force on her back.

if it was not for my advanced planning and points never to enter the house, never to directly interact with them… i would have been in jail, and had no alibi.. since i also took it to myself to spend as much time ‘with’ people and such and not sit in my apartment by myself for long periods. I learned a lot from her false accusation prior.

your only going on your SENSE and FEELINGS… you havent actually sat there and said… which is more risky.. being in kalamazoo, or being in her living room… you think the two are equivalently safe, and i am here to tell you your an idiot and ripe for the peeling. since the equation in the living room situatio depends on HER and what she is or is not willing to do, and how vindictive she may be… in the kalamazoo situation, it dont matter one whit…

go ahead… be an agent provacateur to get some to your ’cause’, but i will tell you right now… that your search for useful idiots should go someplace else and mine your succcess from someone elses misery… all you want is an ego pull from playing god and have a pool of people in ’situations’ where you can give advice and experiment in their lives… sociopathcally this should make for some interesting entertainment, but ultimately they will pay the price for your inane cognition. the only reason anyone might pay attention to you, and your well aware of it since your fishing here, is that they are in seriolus pain and dont know what to do. you have no expertise, no experience, not even an ability to reason honestly about the problem, but your going to step forward and pretend to be something that your obviously not. thats pretty sick actually… its the kind of thing that a borderline personality would love as it makes them seem to have purpose, and as long as they can delude themselves they can prey on these men who are in bad straights, and delude themselves into how important and good their work and lives are.

while your heart may be in the right place… that doesnt mean you should step in and do this just because you can… the socialistic concept that there is no merit, but ideals, means that you have idealed your way into imagining that you can help, but have no willingness to use merit to judge your effectiveness, and direction.

the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

[do note that every person that comes to you for help seeking merit, is kept from going to someone else that may have merit and be able to help. so by doing what your doing, and not having the competency to do it, you actually serve the otehr side more than the side your vanity thinks youre serving]

Right to parent, most likely “family lawyer” is a feminazi troll…. and I’m certainly not concerned about writing in a “pretty harsh” manner to those vermin.

familylawyer,
Sorry. I’m as fed up as any on this site, but I would appreciate any comments you might provide on the parallels between the Missouri case just decided and the process required to disturb the status of a natural guardian (strict scrutiny) before the family court has the power (parens patriae) to establish a custody order under under the best interest standard. Now, who has the natural right to guardianship? Unless a.) God’s law has changed, or b.) we have lawfully adopted a new matriarchal or egalitarian standard, the father has a fudamental, natural right to guardianship. This dictates the standard of review.

Now, New York adopted a constitutional amendment that states a woman (not a “wife”) has the same rights and responsibilities in a marriage as a man. I would argue the law can only apply to a marriage under the license and not a Christian marriage protected by common law. And if the rights are equal, we also have a problem with the unilateral application for IV-D services by one spouse in a joint legal separation. At what point does a father loose his rights, allowing the use of the lower “best interest” standard of review?

In other words, the law is a mess. But the mess can be traced to the universal acceptance of the use of legislation regulating the placement of state wards without the consideration of the father’s natural guardianship status. Any thoughts?

Missouri case:

http://www.courts.mo.gov/courts/pubopinions.nsf/ccd96539c3fb13ce8625661f004bc7da/536a51a7f299052a862573840050bcb8?OpenDocument

Artfldgr, “I can tell right now that you have never been in the situation.”

Yes, unfortunately I have been, and I won’t bore you with the details. I have been at this for over 10 years and have learned a little myself over that time. Do the research, then tell me something I don’t know.

you dont want to have a piss fight on facts… ask those that haev seen my debating…

out of all that i said, the only thing you could come to refute my points as to the nature of your advice, is “i did have something happen to me, so your wrong, and i must be an expert”.

its ok.. you dont have to bore me with the details, as it depends, as i said, on the extreme of the persons NOT just the extreme of the law.

my ex faked her murder… a few years after she was long gone, she took my son and her two kids with her to rob a bank… served 2 years in club fed..

until you have THAT kind of story, and THAT kind of experience, you wont want to try to understand my point..

its one thing to think the law is tilted.. but its another thing to see the full potential of it when its used by someone that has no limits.

oh.. i never got custody… he is in college, hasnt lived with his mom for years.. but she still gets child support… AND i try to send some to my son and my parents where he lives (out of state too far)

last thing i needed AND My son needed was to go through all that.. out of state and other things would have jacked up the whole price thing.. she wouldnt have had to pay.. i couldnt bring up her ‘crimes’, and ultimately, i could be blamed for her necessity of robbing a bank…

i have been in this situaiotn since early 80s… when did you start?

what extreme thing did she do? i bet i can top it with a whole lot of things mine did (how about shoplifting while pregnant since no one wants to arrest a pregnant woman. meanwhile, she didnt need to shoplift… the list goes on)

sorry you experienced it… but obviously, you didnt read your own statistics since they tend to validate what i say “that its not safe”, and that outcomes wont make “common sense”. or are you going to tell me the stats say its better?

I really am sorry you had such a hard time, Artfldgr. However, the point I am trying to make is men need to stand up for their rights, and they will be unable to do that if they don’t understand the rights they are trying to protect, and the law that protects them. Otherwise, leave it to the lawyers. That’s all you can do.

I’m not going to argue about who had the most terrible experience. Several thousand of us are in the same boat, to some degree. How do we fix it? Isn’t that the bottom line?

“Dr. Helen
Ask Dr. Helen: Should Men Get Married?”
No. Women are the most ruthless creatures on the planet.

right2parent: How do we fix it? Ultimately, the marriage strike, coupled with an effective male oral contraceptive (whose baby did you say it is?) is the only long-term solution. Too many posters on this board envision some return to the past, where men and women joined together in holy matrimony in the eyes of God (sic), forsaking all others, subjugating their will to the almighty, blah blah blah. It doesn’t exist anymore, too much has changed. But it IS classic Christian-Republican pining for the days of yore.

Roger Knight said:
“No-fault divorce. It does not MATTER whether it is my fault or somebody else’s. It does not MATTER what I do other than to pay the EXTORTION.

In criminal law, imagine if it did not MATTER whether the defendant committed the crime, he is automatically sentenced to peonage under threat of imprisonment anyway.”

He is correct. If right and wrong don’t matter, then the only answer is to not play the game. And with the neocons cracking down on liberty everywhere, we are almost to the point where it does not matter if any defendant committed a crime, he can be imprisoned indefinitely anyway as an “unlawful enemy combatant”, property seized, and be tortured, just because the President wants to. Imagine when Hillary becomes president and gets these powers, even those of you who think Bush is doing the right thing. Steven Baskerville, report to the Gulag.

People thought I was crazy to get out of the system! I did get the Nazi treatment from the courts, I have been divorced twice! I wanted to get my life back and to do this it takes extreme actions.
I had to make my life invisible and use lawful( no not legal remedies) to strip the tribunals( ie what you call courts) of their control over my ” Strawman” since I did that,the thieves and terrorist( ie the legal system) have become more manageable.
Oh.. they are still bullies and arrogant as hell, but now they have alot of their power taken away they act a whole lot more reasonable. This make the also arrogant exwife more reasonable, now that the corporate state cannot aid and abet her little act of rebellion. That if they act bad now they will get punished not rewarded!
You see the ” legal system” is based on commercial law, the constitution and the concept of right and wrong have absolutely have nothing to do with it! Now… you still have support you kids, but in a private arrangement where you have a position of strength to negotiate from. This takes away the deal where they can do any damn thing they want and get away with it and you still have to pay reguardless of what they do. Fair and right is still fair and right.
When you start to reaquire property, you make it so the state and the ex can not get their dirty little hands on it. It is yours and will stay yours. You do this by incorporating and using trust instruments. It does work, I have just started to recover and this is what I am doing. Using their own crooked little system against them. It is extreme , but the situation calls for extreme. I am not a criminal, I don’t do anything to unrightful or unlawfully take anything from any living soul. I do work for a living and don’t mind doing so, as long as I keep most of what I make. My boys can have anything I have, but the exwives and the state… well I wouldnt’ piss on them if they were on fire. I do not do revenge, I figure when God get shis hands on them, he will do an good job of correcting their bad attitudes and making them see the They will learn that really did not get away with anything they done.
I am not a victim, but I am not yet a victor, but then a lot of men who now feel like victims can retake control of their lives and cut off the money,power and control away from the system. Thereby motivating them to stop acting like thieves and terrorist and start acting like compliant, obedient and respectful servants. Stop stealing and threatening and instead operate a real system based on right and wrong. Administer justice instead of a ” shake down” racket
I do feel a duty to inform these misguided people that if they don’t straighten up, that not only will they be severe consequence for them , but for our whole society.

OMG, it’s 2007 and someone is still asking if men should get married? What for?
Grief? Misery? Loss of sexual activity AFTER the IDO?

Go figure, and the person calls him/herself “Family Lawyer”.

Oh, wait, wait wait…it’s all coming back. The sweet sexual dynamic woman I married really didn’t change, it was all me. Dang. I only thought the money she stole, the false insurance papers she filed on lost jewelry (ala the engagement ring) the refusal to allow me to interact with my own child, the lying, the refusal to go back to work after the birth of my daughter, the refusal to let my family visit (course hers all had keys) the abuse of my daughter by HER really were MY fault. Aha!

And lastly, why would anyone give a rat’s a** what someone who refers to him/herself as “Family Lawyer” has to say about family courts men’s rights and a father’s loss of his children.

Remember those heady days of court? I had 84 of them so I still recall the “Family Lawyers” walking around tolling up hourly fees watching men get butchered. First it should be named Unfamily Court and secondly ANYONE that makes that kind of statement is pulling you/our/my chain.

p.s. Helen, thanx for posing the question, judging from the number and volume of the responses it touched a VERY raw nerve. But, as far as fighting back – How? I remember the time I asked for custody (the 2nd of what would be 84 visits to court). The head hjudge was asked to come into the family mediation room. He sat down and pout his face about 6 inches from my face (still remember the killer tie he was wearing). He said to me “I know why you’re asking for custody. Yous just donb’t want to pay child support”. “Ypou’re not going to it get it (child support), I am noit saying to you that you can’t ask for it but I’m telling you, you are not going to get it”. He stood up looked at ma and walked out of the room.

This was said out loud in from of moi, my attorney and the ex and her attorney AND the head of child mediation at the time.

The following day I was speaking to my own attorney and remarked how angry I was that the judge made the remark and MY attorney swore he could not remember that judge ever uttering those words.

So, I did continue the custody and eventually won, but, when even the lawyers you hire are afraid of going up against a judge how many men will continue the fight? As a start I fired that attorney quick and the next two who were reluctant to represent me in a fight for my daughter. Well over $100,000 and a heart attack later it was the best fight I ever got into.

But, the answer to your question about why many more men won’t fight is that the system makes sure you can’t. Through intimidation by the very judges themselves, through the enormous costs associated with a fight and the way Family Law” is constructed. One motion, the entire day is spent waiting at hundreds of dollars and then postponed for another similar day. Go to a typical family court if you’ve never done so. Talk to many of the men there who are afrid. You can sense it.

Sorry, but when you read “Family Lawyer” and have witnessed the betrayal of so many men by so many women it’s hard NOT to spout off.

I cannot imagine every getting re-married. Ever.

My suggestions are:

Get a job in Brazil, Singapore, China, or Korea. Move there, marry there, stay there, and don’t come back. No marriage is safe unless it is based in a culture that supports the institution of marriage (i.e., the government refuses to socialize the family like Castro socialized business in Cuba and Mao socialized business in China).

I worked overseas for years. I studied the cultures in various countries, and am able to offer some valuable insights.

While the creature comforts in Brazil, China, and Korea are not as good, and in China you can’t waste your time on politics (which is largely a useless waste of time in America), you will have a wife that truly understands the value of having a husband, and you will be living in a society that hold marriage highly and refuses to allow western-style feminists and lawyers to come in and socialize the family.

In these countries, women prefer American men because they have been beaten up so badly by feminists here that they treat women with much more respect than local men do.

Of course, there are some bad tempered women, and loose ones like anywhere else. If you pick a woman who is nice now, the chances are pretty good she won’t change after the ring goes on.

Advantages/Disadvantages:

Brazil: no middle class. You need to establish yourself in a business that attracts upper-class clientele or you will not do well. If you marry a local, you can start an English school very easily even if you don’t know Portuguese. Stay away from the party towns, beaches, and slum areas. Smaller towns inland are best. You get permanant citizenship status upon marrying a Brazilian. My understanding is that Brazil does not recognize any foreign marriages or child support orders.

China: Women are very very nice and mostly conservative. They think American feminists are nuts. I was overwhelmed with nice women handing me a photo and their address and asking me to give it to some nice guy when I got home. They respected the fact that I was married — not one of them made inappropriate advances. Check out citizenship: I don’t know how that works. If you go there, don’t overstay your visa because they will find you and lock you up right away. Forget politics. Enjoy your life. In China, folks who can repair American cars command great respect: Chinese officials love big American cars — and with that comes steady income and political safety. Northern parts of China are very cold and most buildings poorly heated. Avoid polluted industrial cities if possible, and forget having a western-style home unless you have a lot of money. Be prepared to learn Chinese. I was shocked by a recent large-group study showing that Chinese have more sex than any other country on the planet. You would never guess it.

Korea: Women are very nice and also conservative. Marriage is a big deal there. But the food is not very good in my opinion. Creature comforts are not great, but generally better than China.

Singapore / Malaysia: Singapore is the nicest, safest, cleanest healthiest city I have ever visited. It is a benevolent dictatorship, not harsh, but has its weird quirks just like New York City does. I’m not sure about citizenship. It is very expensive to live in Sing. Plenty of international job opportunities here. Everyone speaks English too. Mass transit is excellent — cars unnecessary and extremely expensive to own — the last time I checked the license to own a car cost $50-grand. Most folks live a 20-minute ferry ride away in Malaysia and commute to Sing. Homes are cheap there, but I think you have to marry a local before you can buy one.

Japan: Japan has the best food on the planet. It is very clean and safe. No politicking, please. Be prepared to work hard and live in a small apartment. Japanese women seemed very nice and polite. But since Japan has always had a strong belief in ethnic purity — you won’t have the same range of marriage opportunities. Caveat: feminism broke into Japan in the early 1990’s when the Osaka court forced a VAWA-like policy on the country. Japan is also in a long economic doldrum that it may never escape from because we stopped buying from Japan and are buying directly from Korea, Sing, China, etc. For years, Japan wasn’t making what we bought from them — they offshored the manufacturing. We cut them out of the loop, leaving their economy longitudinally deflated. I do have doubts about Japan: the nouveau-rich children of hard working 60’s Japanese are spoiled rotten, addicted to work and video games. Prostitution and pornography are becoming endemic in major cities. Given the fact most Japanese live in high-rise apartments that remind me of section-8 housing, and in combination with rising divorce rates, the larger cities could become quite dangerous if things fall apart socially. I think Japan is a civilization in decline. But if you want a simple life in a beautiful country, some of the smaller towns might be excellent choices.

Europe: I see no safe long-term opportunities there. Russia is still Bolshevik. Most of the CIS countries have joined the EEC, which means they bought into all the feminist laws and socialism of the family that goes with EEC membership. While some countries have not yet begun implementing these requirements, it will happen withing our lifetimes. The current strength of the EEC dollar will quickly be offset when the chickens come home to roost. The EEC basically legalized illegal immigration to encourage instant migration of people from former CIS countries (which had high birth rates), to old-line EEC countries. Their strategy was to solve the population ratio problem of working hands to retirees by opening the floodgates. This is working in the short run. But I think it will fall apart in the long run: they will experience high crime rates, a lot of people who don’t assume local culture, we will see more ethnic conflict, and the former CIS countries may end up fully deflated — thus placing a monstrous drag on the Euro.

(Note: the above is precisely why Bush wants to legalize illegal immigration. As the Dollar slides, there will be increasing pressure for America to change its population ratios, and to become more efficient by importing cheap labor, to keep up with the advantage the EEC is currently enjoying.

Hope this helps!

David!!! great answers..

may i also add that indonesia is anotehr country that has great women. i ended up marying a chinese indonesian.. I am VERY happy… and she is too… we plan on a family, and are working hard for it. she is one of the most sane and wonderful people i have met in a long time and i am very honored and graced by her company.

however, i have to warn that in ALL these countries, there are a lot of bad people too… there are a lot that target americans… and from china, there are even some that target for the state (as my freind found out… what a mess!!!)

however, one thing i can definitely say… is if you value the person more than the trappings, and you have good values, and are a consistent and positive and trustworthy person, you cant do better than to be part of one of these less modernized cultures.

the ONLY point i have to make a comment on in your thing, and its a funny one.

“Be prepared to learn Chinese. I was shocked by a recent large-group study showing that Chinese have more sex than any other country on the planet. You would never guess it.”

the chinese have a country with BILLIONS living at subsistence and you cant guess that they are more sexual (in a natural way), than the west? (the women are more feminine too, and so they LIKE men!)

now thats funny…

I noted that in the Netherlands, and France women seem to value men much more than here in America. ( I end up spending most of my time in africa where the men are downright irresponsible) In airports, and in towns there seems to be a lot more affection between the sexes. Could the readers, including Mr. Usher, comment on this phenomena? That “liberated” European women appear to like the company of men, and in many instances hold them in esteem.

Or, are they not really liberated? It might all be relative. Perhaps Sweden is not as good as France, Spain is better than Poland, and Greece better than Germany. I noticed that even UK women, who have an attitude problem toward men, are much more civilized than American women. The narcissim of females in this country is phenominal.
Traveling men, educate us. Chris Burchfield

Good article, however, I think a more pertinent question might be: Do today’s women want their sons and daghters to get married?

When you consider the fact that the current No-Fault divorce laws allow one spouse to unilateraly decide to end a marriage over the objections of the other spouse and without any requirements to provide a valid reason to end the marriage, you can’t help but realize that our current laws have turned marriage vows into quaint, meaningless relics of a bygone era. When you consider the blatant sexist attitudes exhibited by our nation’s so-called “family courts” in the way that they almost always grant primary custody and decision-making authority over children to women, you can’t help but realize that they are relegating fathers to the role of part-time visitors and full-time ATMs.

Furthermore, when you combine the fact that the overwhelming majority of divorces in this country are initiated by women with the fact that prominent women’s groups like NOW consistently, publicly and vehemently oppose common-sense efforts to reform divorce and child custody laws by enacting joint custody/shared parenting laws, it sends a very clear message that most women either don’t want their children to get married when they become adults, or they just don’t care enough to do anything about the idiotic mess that our society has made.

Rest assured, our nation’s young men are getting the message, loud and clear!

From:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-09-12-census-marriage_N.htm?csp=34

The percentage of married people in their 20s dropped dramatically from 2000 to 2006.

Almost three-quarters of men and almost two-thirds of women in their 20s in 2006 said they had never been married, according to Census data released today that shows a sharp increase in never-married twentysomethings in just six years.
Among men ages 20-29, 73% said they had never been married in 2006, compared with 64% in 2000. For women, 62.2% had never married in 2006, compared with 53.4% six years earlier.

The data also show the percentage of those marrying in their 20s continues to decline

Hello Christopher,

I’ve noticed as well that even women in Western Europe generally have a better attitude towards men than in the U.S.A. I have a number of theories:

1) Before feminism, there was a shortage of women due to the frontier mentality and prostitution was often illegal. A constant stream of male immigrants also tended to contribute to the woman shortage. This helped give women in the states an attitude of entitlement. In addition:

2) Madison Avenue in the states was successful at producing commercial goods in the U.S.A that women wanted to buy. Most consumer goods are bought by women. In Europe, “old” things are fashionable while in the states people are encouraged to buy everything new every few years. Women feel they need mo’ money here and this is reflected in their determination to squeeze every penny out of men.

3) Race relations. I fell back in laughter hearing upper middle class college women compare themselves to former African slaves, but they really do think that they’ve had it tough. That rich white women were oppressed while men had all the fun in the coal mines. This kind of PC group entitlement didn’t exist in Europe even though they’ve imported it from the states.

4) Romance in America: RIP: Feminism promised that women would hold open their own doors and pay their own way and dammit if many men actually took them up on it! There are still polite men (who are polite in general) while the women act like troglodytes, but the days of men automatically treating women like princesses in the states are over. European men are very traditional in their treatment of women but the women also make an effort to be polite and feminine.

Those are the top 4 reasons. It’s a real mess. I don’t know if this is all going to magically fix itself because look at what happened with Yugoslavia. Europe has seen bloodbaths that took centuries just to reach a cease fire point.

That in America women initiate divorce about 85% of the time.

In the approximate 220 countries in the world America has one of the highest divorce rates.

A married man risks losing without reason (no-fault), against his desire (unilateral), his children, wife, property, eighteen years of income, and certain liberties.

That a feminist-drive American county government now offers women who initiate divorce online.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/broward/sfl-flbclerk1112nbnov12,0,3701326.story