A drawback to fulltime homemaking: No retirement

2008-01-26
By

Throughout most of her married life, my mother was a housewife. She is now pushing 80 years old, extremely overweight, and ridden with arthritis and other health troubles. She is often tired. Whenever I talk to her on the phone, she almost always complains, I’m not doing what I need to do around here or I’m not getting my work done. She always expresses guilt because she has supposedly left the house in a mess.

My parents live in another state but I was able to visit them awhile back. Since my mother had complained so frequently about not doing her housework, I decided to see if a great deal of dust had accumulated in the guest room in which I stayed. I took a paper towel and carefully rubbed it over every solid surface in the room.

When I finished, the paper towel had picked up only a small modicum of dust.

The home was cluttered but it was quite clean and neat.

My father worked as a taxi driver before retiring. In all of the years he has been retired, I have never once heard him express the slightest guilt for not picking up enough fares.

One of the major drawbacks to fulltime homemaking is that there is no clear and official retirement from it. Thus, despite her age and ill health, my mother feels that she is falling down on the job.

I have listened to self-talk tapes and used self-talk cards. These are positive messages that a person is supposed to repeat in order for them to sink into the unconscious as well as the conscious.

I made up a card for my mother that reads as follows: I give myself permission to retire from fulltime homemaking.

People using self-talk messages are advised to repeat the message at least three times, giving stress to different parts of it each time. For example, in the above message one might stress the I and the myself in one go-round. Then one might stress permission and homemaking. A third time, one might stress retire.

I don’t know if that card is doing my mother any good.

However, I mailed it to her and she told me she has it.

So at least I know I’ve done my part to help her retire from fulltime homemaking and, hopefully, enjoy her retirement.

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  • PolishKnight

    Most women actually do retire from full-time homemaking in stages: Childbearing years take about 10 years or so. After that, the children are in school most of that time. Then there are the empty nester years. Finally, and I hate to be rather morbid about this, there’s the death of her spouse.

    Ironically, your mother’s problem isn’t one of the “work” grinding at her, from what I read, but rather that she views what she does as a calling and a career. Your father apparently had a relaxed view about his work from what I understand. It’s interesting that you’re making an argument for your mother to not “work” anymore. Isn’t that what traditionalists argued for women leaving the workplace and staying at home after they married?

    As you note, most of this is voluntary. She’s her own boss and quite demanding. If feminism is about empowering women to make choices, then your mother has made hers.

    FYI: I’m happy for you both your parents are alive at such an old age.

  • David R. Usher

    Denise,

    We don’t need yet another recitation of one-eyed feminist victim folklore.

    Men don’t get to retire from fixing the toilet, shoveling snow, fixing the car, painting the house, and even doing some of the housework. Perhaps you should be writing for a feminist publication?

    The one drawback to being a full time homemaker is that she doesn’t get much in social security. Now, that might be a reason to work part time after the kids have gone to school, or perhaps after the parents are “liberated”.

  • David R. Usher

    Boy am I glad I’m not your husband. What do you do, sit around and watch Oprah all day? With all the gadgets we have, does it really take 8 hours a day to keep the house clean and do the shopping?

    Speaking of husbands, if you had half a brain you would talk about what happens to single women, who have to do all the housework, shopping, fix the toilet, shovel the snow — and then they get to retire on one social security check.

    Lovely what you feminists complain about.

  • David R. Usher

    Denise,

    Aging is not easy. Folks have to survive, often on less money, and with failing health. Our job as children is to be supportive of them, not to destroy their marriages with hippie feminist radicology.

    If you wanted to be a good daughter, you would send them a note offering a gift of $500-$1000 towards anything they need, and suggest maid service, house repair, etc. as things they could use it for. Let them work it out. It is their marriage, not yours.

  • http://mensnewsdaily.com/author/denise-noe/ Denise Noe

    David R. Usher said,

    Denise,

    We don’t need yet another recitation of one-eyed feminist victim folklore.

    Men don’t get to retire from fixing the toilet, shoveling snow, fixing the car, painting the house, and even doing some of the housework. Perhaps you should be writing for a feminist publication?

    (Denise) I write for just about anything I can write for. My father, who is 82, shoveled the snow when it fell not long back. He still regularly mows the lawn and raises a few vegetables in the garden. He washes the dishes and sometimes does housework at my mother’s instructions.

    David R. Usher: The one drawback to being a full time homemaker is that she doesn’t get much in social security. Now, that might be a reason to work part time after the kids have gone to school, or perhaps after the parents are “liberated”.

    January 27, 2008 at 7:07 pm
    David R. Usher said,

    Boy am I glad I’m not your husband. What do you do, sit around and watch Oprah all day? With all the gadgets we have, does it really take 8 hours a day to keep the house clean and do the shopping?

    (Denise) My husband? You mean my mother’s husband, don’t you? I’m divorced.
    I am disabled and was never a very good or conscientous housewife. Dust doesn’t bother me. You could probably write your name on the tops of some of the furniture at my place.

    David R. Usher: Speaking of husbands, if you had half a brain you would talk about what happens to single women, who have to do all the housework, shopping, fix the toilet, shovel the snow — and then they get to retire on one social security check.

    (Denise) Interesting topic, Mr. Usher. Thanks for the suggestion.

    David R. Usher: Lovely what you feminists complain about.

    (Denise) Mr. Usher, did you ever read my essay, “The Titanic and What Men Are Like”? Did you read “Courtesy and Society’s Matriarchal Aspect”? How about “Why Homelessness is a Man Thing”?

    January 27, 2008 at 7:11 pm
    David R. Usher said,

    Denise,

    Aging is not easy. Folks have to survive, often on less money, and with failing health. Our job as children is to be supportive of them, not to destroy their marriages with hippie feminist radicology.

    If you wanted to be a good daughter, you would send them a note offering a gift of $500-$1000 towards anything they need, and suggest maid service, house repair, etc. as things they could use it for. Let them work it out. It is their marriage, not yours.

    (Denise) My parents used to live in a shabby trailer. After my divorce, I used part of the money to help them buy a regular home in my mother’s hometown of Bolivar, Missouri. They later paid me back.
    For my mother’s birthday, I once sent her a certificate that bought her a day’s maid service.

  • amfortas

    Women LOVE housework. It turns them on. Well, it does when her husband does the hoovering and the washing up, moves the furniture arbitrarily from one place to another, (or even better, where she tells him to move it, three times, ‘no, try it there, for a moment’) nips down to the supermarket for three hours and gets a month’s shopping in (minus the odd item she just remembered), washes every piece of clothing in sight and hangs it out instead of using the dryer, takes the curtains down and irons them (I could never understand why anyone would do that) makes the dinner and runs her a bubble bath.

    She is even horny when she is single and does it all herself.

    Housework is the BEST cure for arthritis. My ex was always telling me that whenever I got it.

  • Artfldgr

    Denise, the problem as you put it is one of perspective. What you are doing is considereing the concept of the minimal duties one does in their lives to have a living space, and a job where one gets paid. While a rich person can pay someone else to maintain their living space, that doesn’t mean maintaining living spaces is a job for everyone. Lets put it this way, with enough money, you can pay someone to wipe your butt, but after that, everyone in the world who does it for themselves, doesn’t get to call it a career choice.

    If a person received all that they needed minimally… all the food they wanted, a decent TV, cable, rent paid, power, medical, etc… all in a minimal level, as if they were a low end trust fund kiddie. They would still have to maintain themselves.

    That its true, until the day you die you will have to maintain your living quarters, dust them, cook for yourself, and more.

    However, whats interesting is that when someone else lives with you, suddenly what happens to all that work that you were already doing? oh, yeah, its supposed to count, the same way that the book what color is your parachute says to count check writing and paying bills is accounting.

    What we don’t do is compare her life and her work level sans him, with her work level with him. does a man who they claim doesn’t do much REALLY expand the work level to such heights, or is she actually making a grouse fest for an extra potato in the pot, and another pork chop on the cookie sheet? Does he actually expand the dust in the house to the point where the work becomes unbearable?

    Of course, how many houses whould she hacve to clean in order to match his contribution? Does her tasks risk her life? After all, a person who works at home, is a person in the safest environment possible, if they want it that way!

    Whats wrong here denise is that men see their whole sacrifice of work and desires as worth SOMETHING, but this trick of mental crap, makes their work worth NOTHING, and so doesn’t count towards the home.

    Think about that… putting in 100k a year doesn’t count. Its what your supposed to do. taking care of the hosue now counts, because no one is supposed to do it.

    Meanwhile, the reason that he doesn’t help with the house much is that he knows what its like to do that work. its easy, and one, if structured right, can get most of it done in short order. However, it’s the woman, like your mom, that has a higher standard. And so he wont help till the problem drops to his standard.

    So what does a woman who stays home get for her work? well, any divorce court will show you she gets the house. And so when he is gone, who cleans it then? Her. she does exactly the same amount of work, because the work is NOT a job. It’s called taking care of yourself.

    His clothing at most is 7 extra pairs of pants, 7 extra shirts, etc… a week… if he works well, many of these women who are grousing, are not willing to pay a domestic. However, the idea that the LUXURY of paying someone to dress you, again doesn’t mean that getting dressed in the morning is a job.

    In fact, today, you have women that cant take care of themselves. the men are perfectly willing to go out, earn money, and have very little access to the fruits of their own labors to their own ends. For the most part, he supports all the ends she wants. The home where and what she wants, the help if any, the nanny if any, etc.

    The problem that you are blind to is that you think, and feminists think that the 7 extra shirts, the 7 extra underwear, etc… the extra pork chop and potato on the plate with the meal you are cooking anyway! and all that is worth a salary that exceeds a CEO that runs a company.

    The worst part is that this trick of mind and false accounting…(yes its false accounting. She is counting ALL her work as going to the charge, when less than 5% goes towards maintaining the husband that is providing everything else).

    This is why divorce is such a shock… she then comes to sudden terms that the extra plate at the table that your setting anyway… isn’t that much… the extra shirts weren’t that much…. but now that she has to earn the cash by working 8-14 hours a day with people she doestn like doing what she can, and also taking care of the home front, turns out to be the worse of the two.

    After all, as a housewife she cant be fired. She makes her own hours. The time she has is her own if she is efficient… in fact the harder he works the easier her job is…

    The more productive he is at his job, the less productive she has to be in hers!!!

    Which means that the feminist concepts of doing housework insures that he isn’t more productive at work, and so the increase of work at home, offsets the gain of his help.

    Meanwhile, a 4% raise could easily pay for a laundry service. and does a housewife lose her job as her tasks are replaced? NO!!! her work gets easier.

    So in the past the smart housewife would keep things well, and move things out of her husbands way, and he would succeed more than those other shleps whose wives didn’t help. he gets more, she gets more. .. he gets less, she gets less… she has to then do more.

    Meanwhile, if you do the work 50 50, you end up negating all comparative advantage!! The families abilities decline to the mean of their abilities.

    To make this make sense imagine an opera singer married to a dancer… in the old way, comparative advantage would be in play and each person would have the wisdom and the sense of self to get out of the way of the person that does the BETTER JOB…

    So in this case, the singer did 100% of the singing,and the dancer did 100% of the dancing… if you add their abilities up, you get 200 as a score. But if you split the work 50/50, the BEST you can EVER get is 100…. (of course each couple that underperforms where they think they should be will end up in divorce as she seeks another that can do better than just average. however, as long as she plays this game not one of her relationships will EVER score past the mean! She will ALWAYS underperform what her mind knows they could be. however until the dancer can sing like the singer, and visa versa, they will never score 200 again!)

    So it’s a trick… a false perspective… what in the old days would be called a vanity… (an acceptance of a false view of self or work that inflates what one is with only a change of mental effect).

    Risk is also not put in this. how many women lose their fingers a year working on a house? Hey! Want to get a queasy feeling… look up things like degloving while doing yard work… you will see the kinds of injuries men get while helping the woman get a garden she can play in while he is out there getting shot at, burned, crushed, etc.

    Even if he works in an office, his life expectancy is lower since he has to get on the highway twice a day at peak accident times.

    All that doesn’t count… and why? because a wealthy person can pay someone to do what they should do as adults. That makes it a job for some… and so that shold make it a job for women… but not that her husband should pay her, or the state. she is getting the returns in her own life and pocket TAX FREE…. Which is why when she goes out to work, and she decides to pay others, she has to also pay taxes on that….

    which is why the state promotes it. how else can the state charge taxes for the work that they cant charge taxes for otherwise? If mom does it, she not only gets 100% of the labor, but 100% of the labor goes to her family. A person has to earn 150% to pay for the 100% of labor and the states share as well… if she works for her family, her family is the group that gets this extra! Not the state, not her boss… so contrary even to Marxist thought, their solution puts her life in the hands of the very person that exploits her and her family.

    If she cant earn 150% the cost of the home task, then she will not break even. But if you also add the car maintenance, travel, increased sick, the increased cost of children who are poorly raised, and on and on. she ends up having to earn 300% in order to break even.

    Here is another analogy… you have a farm… you grow corn… but you are upset that the corn you eat doesn’t earn money… so you sell the corn you eat, and then buy it back to eat…

    That’s what women are doing… they are exchanging a higher efficiency outcome, for a lower efficiency outcome made lower by taxes.

    In this way, the state, that wants to make socialist programs, gets to tax the labor on baby sitting, day care, housecleaning, shopping, etc. (not to mention that by not having time the stores get to have wider profit margins as shoppers cant go from place to place for best prices). in effect, a good housewife, can double the income her husband brings in and changes the whole dynamic.

    otherwise they are going to lose whatever imagined benefit they will get because they have to pay taxes on the transaction between the mother and the worker… this transaction between mates is tax free in the old system.

    So basically the feminsits doom a family to mediocrity mathematically insured, as well, as cause a drain of their work to taxes… so mom who works in effect is funding the state… while a mom who doesn’t work is denying the state the taxes on her labor

    this can clearly be seen if two women end up working for each other watching each others kids. By definition they should break EVEN…

    however, with this mental flip, they actually come out a lot poorer!!!

    If they pay each other minimum wage, the difference in pay out is exactly the cut the state gets.

    So the difference in efficiency of the family is this difference when she works

    Meanwhile, the same two women, if they don’t make it a monetary exchange, get to exchange withtout the tax man… their end result is exactly the same as if they payed each other minimum wage, and there were no taxes to be paid!!!

    How bout those apples?

  • Artfldgr

    hey denise, when does the job of bodyguard and provider unto death for a man stop?

    Man Carves Wife a 6,000 Stair Path in Mountain
    http://www.weirdasianews.com/2007/12/15/man-carves-wife-a-6000-stair-path-in-mountain/

    In the beginning, they had nothing, no electricity or even food. They had to eat grass and roots they found in the mountain, and Liu made a kerosene lamp that they used to lighten up their lives.

    Started the second year of living in the mountain, Liu began, and continue for over 50 years, to hand carve the steps so that his wife could get down the mountain easily.

    so how much is HIS work worth? 50 years of labor to provide steps for his wife when she is old…

    here is HIS reward….

    The couple had lived in peace for over 50 years until last week. Liu, now 72 years-old, returned from his daily farm work and collapsed. Xu sat and prayed with her husband as he passed away in her arms.

    and the womans lament

    “You promised me you’ll take care of me, you’ll always be with me until the day I died, now you left before me, how am I going to live without you?” …

    my grandmother cried EVERY day for my grandfatehr. asking god why did he take him at 82… and left her to live to 97…. we took care of her in our own homes, not warehoused her…. women want to get paid for this kind of work… no?

    Xu spent days softly repeating this sentence and touching her husband’s black coffin with tears rolling down her cheeks.

    of course, your probably thinking that this man was aweful… after all his wife wasnt paid money for waht work she was doing… she wasnt given the state 1/3 of her labors…

    no she was giving to her family 100% and denying the state their share…

    and her husband knew it…. so he provided for her, as husbands inthe west do, for life past his own death!

    hey! how many women prepare things for their husbands life afetr their deaths? how many wait till he dies to get that, or cash out early draining him of all he has to excange for love and company? (as is clear from everythign that he himiself is not worth anything. not one iota. unlike women, no one does all this just because they love a man, the way that men pledge and do do this for women)

    hey! take some time to read about the carnegie heroes fund

    http://www.carnegiehero.org/resources_audio_list.php

    let me know how many women responded…

    A Century Of Heroes

    On April 4, 1917, five men picked their way through pack ice to save several hunters stranded on a drifting floe.

    and where were the wives? risking life?

    On December 25th, 1906, three young men went to help a skater who’d fallen through weak ice. a deaf person… he broke through the ice… three men were drowning… two men drowned and died helping.

    On October 19, 1964, a collision between two fuel ships let a family demonstrate their skill and bravery. all three family members survived and at the fathers orders, helped saved dozens of men.

    how old is your mom? how old is your dad?

    what about this man? WHEN does HE get to RETIRE from dying for someone else?

    On January 24, 1952, David Andrews, a 67-year-old farmer, kept a neighbor from being buried alive.

    On February 9, 1940, Joseph Arcaris faced down five lions to save a man.

    On October 1, 1971, Malcolm Aspeslet rescued his co-worker from a grizzly bear.

    On April 19, 2000, Lyle Baade, a heart-transplant recipient, prevented a massacre.

    On February 5, 1915, two men risked their lives to save a child who dashed into the path of an oncoming train.

    On July 17, 1904, 17-year-old Louis Bauman Jr. risked his life to keep a friend from drowning.

    On June 6, 1961, Shelby Becknell braved an acid shower to rescue a co-worker.

    On June 12, 1941, thirteen-year-old Norma Ann Bedell saved a toddler from an enraged pig.

    On January 16, 2000, Gerald Bowles got out of his car on an interstate to aid an accident victim.

    On January 22, 1926, Grover Brewer, a Texas clergyman, saved three children from a rabid dog

    On December 29, 1980, William Brisbane scaled the outside of a burning building to save a woman trapped on an eighth-floor balcony.

    On October 11, 1926, Mary Brown, a 15-year-old schoolgirl, risked her life trying to keep a man from murdering his five-year-old son.

    On December 20, 1909, nurse Mary Brown was shot while disarming a delirious patient before he could hurt others.

    On April 18, 1969, twelve men risked their lives to rescue a co-worker after a mining accident.

    On January 10, 1918, 13-year-old Vernon Callaway stood in shoulder-deep freezing water for an hour to keep a schoolmate from drowning.

    On January 9, 1968, John Carlton and Richard Scholfield landed their helicopter on a burning building to help save its inhabitants

    On March 9, 1917, 14-year-old Lily Clarke saved her younger sister and two other children from drowning.

    On February 6, 1923, Charles Coe died while trying to save two small children from their burning home.

    On March 27, 1966, Joseph Coleman, a priest and police chaplain, rescued two young girls being held hostage.

    Two days before Christmas 1959, Manuel Corral volunteered to be lowered headfirst into an abandoned well to save a child.

    On August 20, 1928, Ernest Davis kept a young man from being pulled to the bottom of Long Island Sound.

    On March 27, 1916, James Dougherty, Edward Davis, and Roger Wells risked their lives to aid stricken co-workers.

    On August 5, 1907, Nathan Duncan saved a man trapped in a collapsing well.

    On February 27, 1974, Victor Edwards got off a bus to rescue four boys floundering in freezing water.

    On April 16, 1997, Daryl Elder and Jerald Bowman pulled a driver from a Florida canal.

    On March 25, 2000, three young Canadian men tried to save a woman swept into dangerous surf.

    On August 30, 1994, John Espada climbed up a Ferris wheel to save two trapped children.

    On July 2, 1939, Yolanda Fabbri jumped into Lake Michigan three times to save two children.

    On July 27, 2001, Eric Fortier saved two friends being mauled by a polar bear.

    On January 16, 1907, Alexander Fraser ventured unprotected into a steam filled room to search for a co-worker he thought was inside. he died after spending 5 minutes in the room. he was cooked inside and out, and never knew that the man he was trying to save, had already left.

    On October 10, 1959, Louis Gorman saved seven people from a murderous gunman.

    On November 17, 1960, Joseph Granahan rushed into a collapsing New York City tenement to save an elderly woman.

    On June 22, 1980, three men took on a gunman firing into a church congregation.

    On June 13, 1982, 14-year-old Carolyn Hartsock braved a blazing house fire to save her younger siblings.

    On May 12, 1963, two young men risked their lives to save a third who’d been swept into deep water.

    On February 12, 1927, Winferd Hathaway rescued five fishermen stranded on frozen Lake Champlain .

    On August 17, 1953, Theodore Henderson, Sr. saved a young girl trapped in her car at the bottom of a murky canal.

    On September 21, 1938, fourteen-year old Richard Holmes saved two neighbors during a hurricane.

    On March 31, 1977, David Jackson stepped into the path of danger to keep a co-worker from being guillotined.

    On November 7, 1960, Stephan Jagusczak and Peter Smoley died trying to save a co-worker.

    On May 4, 1933, David Jones and Benjamin Major risked their lives to save a fellow worker from an explosion.

    On June 28, 2001, Robert Keane and David Cirasuolo saved five people in a boat about to be swept over a spillway.

    On October 3, 1927, Lewis Kee stopped a murderous husband from killing his wife and her aunt.

    On January 14, 1938, 16-year-old Ralph Kelley helped two women trapped in a New Hampshire factory fire.

    On May 19, 1912, Iram Kevorkian waded toward the edge of Niagara Falls to save a total stranger.

    On January 19, 1956, Dorothy Kochs, an exotic dancer saved two policemen in a Cleveland nightclub.

    On January 11, 1907, Marie Langdon braved sub-zero temperatures and deep snow to help her neighbors.

    On November 13, 1909, 14 men helped save hundreds from a blazing mine.

    On April 19, 1924, Ruby Lindsay, a high school sophomore, saved her teacher from being killed on a railroad bridge.

    On May 24, 1916, Elmer McArthur risked his life trying to save two men from drowning.

    On July 30, 1964, Addie McCormick, a switchboard operator, lost her life while warning hotel guests about a fire.

    On March 16, 1962, Elsie McEvoy saved a young neighbor from being mauled by a cougar.

    On February 12, 1910, Forest McNeir saved a Houston fireman.

    On December 13, 1932, Representative Melvin Maas confronted a man who had a loaded pistol inside the U.S. Capitol Building

    On February 21, 1963, 11-year-old Kenneth Magallanes volunteered to be lowered into an abandoned cesspool to save a two-year-old boy.

    On March 26th, 1912, 12-year-old Henry Mathews volunteered to be lowered into an abandoned well to save a younger boy.

    On February 19, 1986, Andrew Mathieson was shot three times while saving his secretary from her enraged husband.

    On August 25, 1999, Jeffrey Miller and Kevin Caffery plucked a would-be suicide from the brink of Nagara Falls .

    On June 16, 1924, Henry Naumann pushed a woman from in front of an on-rushing train. a woman tried to beat a train… he ran and saved her… it happened again, the day before he was to retire… the woman died, he lost his leg, and is one of only four twice honored. he lost his leg.

    On May 5, 1954, John O’Neill leapt into the Hudson River to save a drowning woman. Two and a half years later, he did it again.

    On May 7, 1959, Shirley O’Neill risked her life to help the victim of a shark attack.

    On May 29, 1922, Harley Pullen, a 12-year-old schoolboy, rescued a man being dragged by a runaway mule.

    On March 18, 1997, three Massachusetts men saved an elderly couple trapped by a collapsing dam.

    On September 4, 1927, Carl Seidner and James Brooks rowed through pounding Pacific surf to rescue a family whose boat had capsized.

    On January 18, 1908, 12-year-old Roy Stokes died attempting to save three young girls who had fallen through thin ice.

    i guess this boy will never get to retire…

    On October 14, 1970, Joseph Wiest crossed hot slag to help a fallen co-worker. a man fell into the slag pit… he ran into the open end and ran on a surface hot enough… he ran 25 feet… put him on his shoulders… he carried him back… he fell in the slag… wiest recovered, but the man he tried to save died.

    On May 21, 1961, James Williams lost his life after saving a boy from drowning in Lake Erie .

    On February 11, 1948, Sam Wohlford trudged all night through a Texas blizzard to save a snowbound family.

    On May 14, 1911, Charles Wright and William Dillard saved a man from the edge of a 2,000-foot cliff.

    On June 11, 1950, Hull Wright and James Woffenden went into a river to rescue six people from drowning.

    hey denise… when to men get to retire… when will the crowd tell him its ok to stand there and do nothing.

    go over the list… go over the whole like of 9000… you WILL find women… but mostly young giirls who havent learned their value yet.

    you will find a lot of young boys 9-10-11-12-13… risking their lives and dying… a lot of the times, its a woman at the other end…

    how much do we pay men to die for us? do we give them a home? do we give them children? do we let them stay safe, while someone else risks to provide that?

    whats worse is that us men can find monument after monument… from the titanic… to the merchant marine memorial in ny… the unknown soldier… perhaps you would enjoy the outcom of nazi europe in america? remember, the nazies were trying to provide better for their kids and women too (their methods are what we quibble about)

    when something happens, as it has done in my life and others… i am pretty sure that when i look up, the more dangerous the situatino i am in, the more likely i will look up to find another guiy willing to die to help me.

    i am also confident that people will let me die when they wont let a woman die… or a child… that on this list i am LAST….

    how much do we pay men for this?

    how many houswives die as a result of taking care of their own spaces, adn letting another person share it in exchange for providing it?

  • Artfldgr

    another way to look at it denise.

    she does a miniumum wage job in exchange for ceo level pay…

    if she got paid the same as the jobs in the real world, she couldnt afford what she is getting in providing those services for herself and a man.

    the only way it comes out to those amounts is if they account things that business doesnt. for instance… she says… she is 24/7.. and so she gets paid for each hour… well sorry toots… i am 24/7 as a software engineer, but they only pay me SALARY…

    so if you do fair accounting on things… almost ALL her work is minimum wage!!! the EXTRA hours cont count… anymore than i get paid extra when i work a weekend…

    meanwhile… lets account how much of the family money as a percentage the man is getting out of his wage?

    i will bet you that teh VAST majority of men, dont even get minimum wage out of their own salary to spend.

    being generous, at 15 dollars an hour… she get 31200 a year.

    if she has a husband that earns 100k a year… do you think he gets to spend 30k of it a year as he wants to?

    nope… he gets as gifts his needs… no one buys him a frivolous thing that says i love you… no his gifts are cheats… she buys him shirts, and gives them as gifts… when she gets clothes when its not a xmas or birthday…

    so he doesnt even get his needs… his needs are gifts… that he pays for himself.

    and his reward? she doesnt want to do anything… but she does want a 300-500k house… of which she could NEVER get it on what her work is actually worth.

    so in essence what she has done with marraige is convert a less than mimumum wage job, into a 6 figure job in which she cant be fired… gets a pension she dient work for… gets to keep it all if it doesnt work… and gets to have tons of pity heaped on her if her husband after doing all that and mowing the lawn, and risking life as a body guard, doesnt take the load off of her?

    how does she take the load off of him? she doesnt… she thinks its entitlement to heap her work, her fair share, onto him…

    ron perlemans wife… married for less than two years… how much does she get? a 2k a day, a hooker is cheaper… what did she do? coordinate the nany, the butler, and the maids work?

    no one does a real analysis like this because it will not favor the vanity mesage for women…

    your work is worth infinite amounts… the fact that you touch it, makes it turn to gold.

    however, when its your money, you dont even want to pay the amount to watch your kid, and the taxes!!!!

    so women are LIARS… they dont value the work…

    however, they dont see that men value it even more..
    which is why you can get a job in this world being yourself taking care of your own space… and just being nice to the persno thast is providinmg it.

    he on the other hand… is worthless… he cant even enter the door and be seen till he has all that junk to offer.

    yes… he has to offer the equivalent of a lifes servitude, taking the risks (she can leave when it gets bad), doing the harder work… risking life..

    and what for?

    so he can provide another person who pitches in less than minimum wage (a small portion of what he is putting in on average), the equivalent lifestyle of her making a lot more money.

    for this she doesnt have to study… she doesnt have to pass any tests… she cant be fired… he has to accept whatever level of work and complaints she gives (or he has to turn everything over to this person for presumption of failure)…..

    in essence… all she has to be is be herself… an if she is herself someonce nice to be with… then she gets all this reward, and all she has to do is a tiny bit more work on top of the work that she does for herself. and if he does better, she doesnt even ahve to do that. if she decides it doesnt work out, she can collect what he offers as gifts or recompense (for what?), and wander off and do it again and again…

    and of course… what women are fighting for is actually MORE than that paragraph above! till they have it all, and there is no longer a society to sponge off of.

    (and they didnt claim hours that just dont exist

  • PolishKnight

    Retirement Pay

    Housewifery actually probably pays BETTER in terms of Social Security benefits than the average working woman since most women usually opt to use their husband’s income to determine benefits rather than their own.

    Amusing statistic: In Europe, many women are allowed to retire an addition 3 to 5 years earlier so that, on average, women who marry men who are older by that amount don’t have to work while the husband is retired. So not only do the women work for fewer years, but also marry up in income to boot.

  • Artfldgr

    Polish knight…

    the scientific term for the behavior your talking about is HYPERGAMOUS…

    women are hypergamous…






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