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	<title>Comments on: Very Much A Lady by Shana Alexander</title>
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	<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/</link>
	<description>Men&#039;s Rights Activism, MRA Politics, Analysis, Commentary and Global News</description>
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		<title>By: amfortas</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/comment-page-1/#comment-60957</link>
		<dc:creator>amfortas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Mar 2008 04:33:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/#comment-60957</guid>
		<description>(Denise) Hello amfortas. I hope one of my most incisive critics is doing well these days.

(Me) I am as well as can be expected for a poverty-striken knackered old shite, Denise, and all the better for your kind hopes for me. :)

Estne volumen in toga, an solum tibi libet me videre?

Thank you for explaining that it was Alexander&#039;s assessment and that you have pointed out other qualities in Tarnower that show a better aspect, less affected by prejudice. I must read more as you suggest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(Denise) Hello amfortas. I hope one of my most incisive critics is doing well these days.</p>
<p>(Me) I am as well as can be expected for a poverty-striken knackered old shite, Denise, and all the better for your kind hopes for me. <img src='http://mensnewsdaily.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Estne volumen in toga, an solum tibi libet me videre?</p>
<p>Thank you for explaining that it was Alexander&#8217;s assessment and that you have pointed out other qualities in Tarnower that show a better aspect, less affected by prejudice. I must read more as you suggest.</p>
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		<title>By: Denise Noe</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/comment-page-1/#comment-60945</link>
		<dc:creator>Denise Noe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 12:08:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/#comment-60945</guid>
		<description>amfortas said,

It must be difficult for a reviewer to maintain an impartiality. But it should be attempted some day. With this nod to your quite normal and usual dispositions, Denise, how do you overlook the small biases that creep in?&gt;&gt;

(Denise) Hello amfortas. I hope one of my most incisive critics is doing well these days.

amfortas: This one for example: &quot;â€¦.sexual attachment that bound her to the self-centered Tarnower&quot;. You mentioned little about his character and nothing at all about him being self-centred. Indeed you say he was a &quot;dedicated physician &quot;. Can one be both, simultaneously? Not that I am judging him either way. I have precious little to go on.&gt;&gt;

(Denise) I was reviewing Alexander&#039;s book which does indeed depict him as both self-centered and a very dedicated physician. You might read the far more detailed article I have on the case at Crime Library. In that piece, I point out that, after his father died, Herman Tarnower supported his mother -- who had not worked outside of the home and had few marketable skills -- for the rest of her life. I also point out that he was not jealous of the ladyloves in his life and never tried to bind any of them to him. Indeed, he urged Jean Harris to look for a man who was the marrying kind.

amfortas: How about this doozy for an unsupported view: &quot;Harris&#039; relationship with her impossible-to-please father formed her early identity as a &quot;good girl&quot; and led to her powerful need for a dominant male image to shore up her shaky sense of self.&quot; Wham bam! No thank you ma&#039;am.

Impossible to please? Not just difficult but impossible. Really? And a relationship with someone who is impossible to please produces &#039;good girl&#039; attributes, does it? Well, that should chuck a fox in the &#039;Raising Kiddies&#039; hen house.

(Denise) In Alexander&#039;s book, Jean Harris&#039;s father does indeed seem &quot;impossible to please.&quot;

amfortas: And since when do women have a shakey self image? Why hasn&#039;t a MAN !! â„¢ been jailed for that? Surely women have a right to whatever image they damned well want. There isn&#039;t a chance that she made her self-image - a notoriously hard image to get right - all by herself, is there? After all we are talking of a middle-aged women here. Why not bring her potty training into the equation? Or the Avon Lady.

I like this one: &quot;â€¦old-fashioned attitudes toward women and a deep fear of marriage&quot; Hmmmmm. The two don&#039;t seem to &#039;hang together&#039;. Maybe Panic, above, is right. Leave the poor chap Tarnower out of it. She should hang by herself.

(Denise) Tarnower DID have both. However, as I already stated, he showed great kindness to his own mother by supporting her after his father died. Since he did not want to marry, he urged those women for whom marriage was important -- like Jean Harris -- to find a man who did.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>amfortas said,</p>
<p>It must be difficult for a reviewer to maintain an impartiality. But it should be attempted some day. With this nod to your quite normal and usual dispositions, Denise, how do you overlook the small biases that creep in?&gt;&gt;</p>
<p>(Denise) Hello amfortas. I hope one of my most incisive critics is doing well these days.</p>
<p>amfortas: This one for example: &#8220;â€¦.sexual attachment that bound her to the self-centered Tarnower&#8221;. You mentioned little about his character and nothing at all about him being self-centred. Indeed you say he was a &#8220;dedicated physician &#8220;. Can one be both, simultaneously? Not that I am judging him either way. I have precious little to go on.&gt;&gt;</p>
<p>(Denise) I was reviewing Alexander&#8217;s book which does indeed depict him as both self-centered and a very dedicated physician. You might read the far more detailed article I have on the case at Crime Library. In that piece, I point out that, after his father died, Herman Tarnower supported his mother &#8212; who had not worked outside of the home and had few marketable skills &#8212; for the rest of her life. I also point out that he was not jealous of the ladyloves in his life and never tried to bind any of them to him. Indeed, he urged Jean Harris to look for a man who was the marrying kind.</p>
<p>amfortas: How about this doozy for an unsupported view: &#8220;Harris&#8217; relationship with her impossible-to-please father formed her early identity as a &#8220;good girl&#8221; and led to her powerful need for a dominant male image to shore up her shaky sense of self.&#8221; Wham bam! No thank you ma&#8217;am.</p>
<p>Impossible to please? Not just difficult but impossible. Really? And a relationship with someone who is impossible to please produces &#8216;good girl&#8217; attributes, does it? Well, that should chuck a fox in the &#8216;Raising Kiddies&#8217; hen house.</p>
<p>(Denise) In Alexander&#8217;s book, Jean Harris&#8217;s father does indeed seem &#8220;impossible to please.&#8221;</p>
<p>amfortas: And since when do women have a shakey self image? Why hasn&#8217;t a MAN !! â„¢ been jailed for that? Surely women have a right to whatever image they damned well want. There isn&#8217;t a chance that she made her self-image &#8211; a notoriously hard image to get right &#8211; all by herself, is there? After all we are talking of a middle-aged women here. Why not bring her potty training into the equation? Or the Avon Lady.</p>
<p>I like this one: &#8220;â€¦old-fashioned attitudes toward women and a deep fear of marriage&#8221; Hmmmmm. The two don&#8217;t seem to &#8216;hang together&#8217;. Maybe Panic, above, is right. Leave the poor chap Tarnower out of it. She should hang by herself.</p>
<p>(Denise) Tarnower DID have both. However, as I already stated, he showed great kindness to his own mother by supporting her after his father died. Since he did not want to marry, he urged those women for whom marriage was important &#8212; like Jean Harris &#8212; to find a man who did.</p>
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		<title>By: amfortas</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/comment-page-1/#comment-60939</link>
		<dc:creator>amfortas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 06:54:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/#comment-60939</guid>
		<description>It must be difficult for a reviewer to maintain an impartiality. But it should be attempted some day. With this nod to your quite normal and usual dispositions, Denise, how do you overlook the small biases that creep in?

This one for example: &quot;....sexual attachment that bound her to the self-centered Tarnower&quot;. You mentioned little about his character and nothing at all about him being self-centred. Indeed you say he was a &quot;dedicated physician &quot;. Can one be both, simultaneously? Not that I am judging him either way. I have precious little to go on.

How about this doozy for an unsupported view: &quot;Harris&#039; relationship with her impossible-to-please father formed her early identity as a &quot;good girl&quot; and led to her powerful need for a dominant male image to shore up her shaky sense of self.&quot; Wham bam! No thank you ma&#039;am. 

Impossible to please? Not just difficult but impossible. Really? And a relationship with someone who is impossible to please produces &#039;good girl&#039; attributes, does it? Well, that should chuck a fox in the &#039;Raising Kiddies&#039; hen house.

And since when do women have a shakey self image? Why hasn&#039;t a MAN !! (tm) been jailed for that? Surely women have a right to whatever image they damned well want. There isn&#039;t a chance that she made her self-image - a notoriously hard image to get right - all by herself, is there? After all we are talking of a middle-aged women here. Why not bring her potty training into the equation? Or the Avon Lady.

I like this one: &quot;...old-fashioned attitudes toward women and a deep fear of marriage&quot; Hmmmmm. The two don&#039;t seem to &#039;hang together&#039;. Maybe Panic, above, is right. Leave the poor chap Tarnower out of it. She should hang by herself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It must be difficult for a reviewer to maintain an impartiality. But it should be attempted some day. With this nod to your quite normal and usual dispositions, Denise, how do you overlook the small biases that creep in?</p>
<p>This one for example: &#8220;&#8230;.sexual attachment that bound her to the self-centered Tarnower&#8221;. You mentioned little about his character and nothing at all about him being self-centred. Indeed you say he was a &#8220;dedicated physician &#8220;. Can one be both, simultaneously? Not that I am judging him either way. I have precious little to go on.</p>
<p>How about this doozy for an unsupported view: &#8220;Harris&#8217; relationship with her impossible-to-please father formed her early identity as a &#8220;good girl&#8221; and led to her powerful need for a dominant male image to shore up her shaky sense of self.&#8221; Wham bam! No thank you ma&#8217;am. </p>
<p>Impossible to please? Not just difficult but impossible. Really? And a relationship with someone who is impossible to please produces &#8216;good girl&#8217; attributes, does it? Well, that should chuck a fox in the &#8216;Raising Kiddies&#8217; hen house.</p>
<p>And since when do women have a shakey self image? Why hasn&#8217;t a MAN !! &#8482; been jailed for that? Surely women have a right to whatever image they damned well want. There isn&#8217;t a chance that she made her self-image &#8211; a notoriously hard image to get right &#8211; all by herself, is there? After all we are talking of a middle-aged women here. Why not bring her potty training into the equation? Or the Avon Lady.</p>
<p>I like this one: &#8220;&#8230;old-fashioned attitudes toward women and a deep fear of marriage&#8221; Hmmmmm. The two don&#8217;t seem to &#8216;hang together&#8217;. Maybe Panic, above, is right. Leave the poor chap Tarnower out of it. She should hang by herself.</p>
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		<title>By: panic</title>
		<link>http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/comment-page-1/#comment-60932</link>
		<dc:creator>panic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 04:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mensnewsdaily.com/2008/03/27/very-much-a-lady-by-shana-alexander/#comment-60932</guid>
		<description>Do you understand how many women decided (or were told by their attorneys) they could use this amusing construct (&quot;I went to kill myself, and we struggled until I accidentally shot him until the gun was empty&quot;) to get away with murder?

Her standard of living as a convicted murderer is only slightly more modest than what her own efforts would have provided in life: a private cottage with  her choice of curtains, a (forgive the pun) captive audience of eager acolytes (including the staff), and a door locked from the inside.

The story of Mrs. Harris should be told as follows: &quot;It is the judgment of this Court that you be taken to a place designated for the purpose, and hanged by the neck until dead.&quot; You know - like in that Bible?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you understand how many women decided (or were told by their attorneys) they could use this amusing construct (&#8221;I went to kill myself, and we struggled until I accidentally shot him until the gun was empty&#8221;) to get away with murder?</p>
<p>Her standard of living as a convicted murderer is only slightly more modest than what her own efforts would have provided in life: a private cottage with  her choice of curtains, a (forgive the pun) captive audience of eager acolytes (including the staff), and a door locked from the inside.</p>
<p>The story of Mrs. Harris should be told as follows: &#8220;It is the judgment of this Court that you be taken to a place designated for the purpose, and hanged by the neck until dead.&#8221; You know &#8211; like in that Bible?</p>
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